In this episode of Mind-Body Solution, Dr Tevin Naidu sits down with two of the most influential thinkers in neuroscience and philosophy of mind: Professor Karl Friston and Professor Mark Solms. Together, they explore one of the deepest questions of our time — can consciousness be built, simulated, or engineered?

Professor Karl Friston (University College London) is one of the most cited neuroscientists in history, pioneering the Free Energy Principle — a unifying theory of brain function, perception, and action.

Professor Mark Solms (University of Cape Town) is a leading neuropsychologist and psychoanalyst, best known for founding neuropsychoanalysis and advancing a theory of consciousness rooted in affect and feeling.

This wide-ranging conversation covers:
- What is consciousness, and how does it differ from intelligence?
- The Free Energy Principle and predictive coding
- Why feeling, not computation, may be the foundation of consciousness
- Can artificial systems ever truly feel, or are they just simulations?
- The role of homeostasis, survival, and affect in conscious experience
- The mind-body problem and the limits of computation
- The ethics of creating artificial consciousness
- Practical strategies: is anyone actively trying to build it right now?

TIMESTAMPS:
00:00 Introduction & episode hook — Why ask “Is it possible to engineer artificial consciousness?”
00:46 What do we mean by “consciousness” vs “intelligence”?
08:10 What is the Free-Energy Principle? Friston explains “minimizing surprise”
09:07 How can we tell if something is conscious?
13:40 Are behavioral tests enough? Mimicry, zombies & misleading appearances
17:13 Homology & shared generative models in communication
21:27 Functional criteria for feeling — policies, agency & affect
25:10 Structure vs function: does substrate matter for consciousness?
29:35 Mortal computation & why “being able to die” matters for feeling
35:33 Biological naturalism vs functionalism — can feeling exist beyond biology?
42:42 Functional architectures, attention & “palpating uncertainty”
48:34 So… is artificial consciousness possible? Friston & Solms respond
52:17 Agency, attention heads & why isolated LLMs fall short
55:12 Reportability as an empirical criterion for consciousness
57:28 Feeling at the core — affect as empirical consciousness
59:40 Mechanistic basis of feeling — precision, policies & dopamine
1:06:30 Constraints shaping conscious systems — homeostasis & viable states
1:12:25 Actively building artificial consciousness — Solms’ current project
1:24:51 Hedonic Place-Preference test & the ethics of machine feeling
1:30:51 Conclusion & closing takeaways

EPISODE LINKS:
- Karl's Round 1: https://youtu.be/Kb5X8xOWgpc
- Karl's Round 2: https://youtu.be/mqzyKs2Qvug
- Karl's Lecture 1: https://youtu.be/Gp9Sqvx4H7w
- Karl's Lecture 2: https://youtu.be/Sfjw41TBnRM
- Karl's Lecture 3: https://youtu.be/dM3YINvDZsY
- Mark's Round 1: https://youtu.be/qqM76ZHIR-o
- Mark's Round 2: https://youtu.be/rkbeaxjAZm4

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ABOUT MIND-BODY SOLUTION:
Mind-Body Solution brings together the world’s foremost thinkers—from science, philosophy, and beyond—to explore life’s most profound questions. This channel bridges the gap between popular media and academia, offering deep, thought-provoking conversations about consciousness, reality, meaning, and more. With rigorous yet accessible discussions, you'll uncover the complexity and wonder of the mind-body problem and the mysteries that shape our existence. Join Dr Tevin Naidu—your host and guide—on a quest to conquer the Mind-Body Problem. Subscribe now and take one step closer to the Mind-Body Solution.

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