Tom Campbell: How Do We Leave The Simulation? Consciousness Beyond The Virtual Reality

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Tom, the first time we spoke we
covered so many different topics

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and your theory of everything is
very fascinating.

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Before we start, I mean this
time we're going to go into a

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lot of the practical
significance and and what it can

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open the doors to.
Before we begin though, would

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you like to just give a brief
summary of what we discussed?

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I'll definitely put a link to
their three-year old plus

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conversation below as well.
Well, let me say to your

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listeners that if they haven't
listened to what we did last

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time, which means you're you're
what do we call that round one

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or or whatever?
If they haven't listened to

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that, they really need to listen
to that first because we're not

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going to go back through all of
that.

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Defining the basics of the model
because that that took us what,

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3 hours or something last time,
Yeah.

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So we're not going to do all
that again.

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So if if you hear things that we
say today that just don't seem

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to make sense, they seem to be
kind of off the wall, it's

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because you missed you know,
something that that would

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explain them and make them and
seem rational and logical.

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So don't just throw it away if
you.

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If you don't quite understand,
you know where we're coming

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from, or if we sound like we're
making things up, it really does

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have a logical foundation
underneath of it.

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So I tell that to your readers.
A a very short summary of the

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model is that it's based on an
assumption that consciousness

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exists.
And that's really the only

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assumption that I have.
Consciousness exists now.

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The model and what I do to make
the model is I start with the

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with the simplest form of
consciousness, which would

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consciousness I'd define as
awareness with a choice.

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OK, so a simplest awareness with
a choice would be an awareness

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that could decide whether is in
state A or state B.

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Because it was only in state A
then it wouldn't have any

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choice.
But because there's two states,

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it's got a choice.
It can be in state one, or state

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two, or A or B or one or zero.
You know however you want to to

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say that.
So that defines the smallest

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piece of consciousness is
awareness.

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With a choice, it only has two
choices, one or two.

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And from that we let it evolve.
And how does consciousness

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evolve?
It evolves by lowering its

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entropy.
Consciousness is an information

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system.
What you're conscious of, what

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you're aware of, you know you're
aware of things, and then you

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get to make choices, right?
So what you're aware of is the

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data your five senses gives to
you. close off all your 5 senses

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and you are just aware only that
you exist.

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You're aware that you're aware
and nothing else.

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You can't see, hear, smell,
taste, feel anything else.

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So all of that.
Awareness that you have is

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basically a data you know is
data that you get from your

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senses.
Your senses are just data

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collectors and your body is a
data sensor platform, right?

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So we get to we come to the
conclusion that consciousness is

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really an information system.
It's about information.

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Think of an information system
where all the all the bits in it

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are all random.
You know, random ones, random

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zeros.
If you want to think in terms of

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binary, like our computers, so
they're all, they're all random.

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Well, if they're random, there
is no information.

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That's the very definition of no
information is that everything's

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random.
Randomness carries no

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information.
So the way you create

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information is by ordering some
of those bits, and then that

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order, whatever that ordering
is.

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Add ordering.
Then can stand for something.

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It can be you know, a symbol for
something else.

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You know.
You can build on that.

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It could just be a number #1.
The number two you know the

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number six.
The ordering is just something

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that the system finds
interesting.

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And the more order it can
produce within that randomness,

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the more information there is.
So how does an information

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system evolve?
It evolves by lowering entropy,

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because entropy is a measure of
disorder.

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So when you start with random
and you order it, you're

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lowering the entropy.
So that's a that's a big part of

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this theory that you have to
understand.

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So this consciousness system now
is going to evolve and if it can

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have two states.
Well, you can have series of

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states.
You can have a A1 and A1 and

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then a zero and a zero, or A1
and A0 and A1 and A0.

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Or it can make up as much as
that it as it needs.

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Because if it's aware, that
means also that it has memory,

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it's aware of things and not
just this moment and nothing

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else, ever.
It's a, you know, it's a, it's

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aware of things as time goes by.
So it has memory.

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So now we can make any kind of
strings of ones and zeros, you

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know, with its within its
memory.

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OK, now it it's evolving further
and it it runs into lots of

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patterns of patterns of.
And it it, it creates time by

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taking a one and a zero and just
alternating that 101010

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regularly and that called,
that's called a metronome And it

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it creates time it well, I
shouldn't say that way time's

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already there.
But it creates regular time, not

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just kind of prior normal time
that things change somehow or

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sometime, but prime, you know,
ordered time, regular time

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that's measured in beats. 01/01
So once has regular time, it can

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also make sequences.
Eventually it runs out of its

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evolutionary space because it's
just one monolithic thing.

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The solutions break itself into
pieces.

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Those pieces are you and I.
We're just pieces of this larger

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consciousness system.
LCSI call it larger

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consciousness system.
So we're just a subset, a

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virtual machine inside a big
mainframe, if you like.

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OK, so that's who we are.
And we all have free will,

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because if we didn't have free
will then there wouldn't be any

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point in breaking it apart.
You just break into a bunch of

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parts that are exactly, you
know, there's no new information

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there.
But if you give each part free

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will, now you have a bunch of
independent players.

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And when you have a bunch of
independent players, what they

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can do together, what they can
create together, is much bigger

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than what just one player is
going to create by themselves.

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One player's limited to just
what that one player can think

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of.
Lots of players can think of

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different things.
And eventually, as time goes on,

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all these players end up very
different from each other.

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That spreads because their
experiences are not exactly the

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same.
Therefore they're not exactly

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the same, which means they
start.

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Looking at issues from different
angles, from different points of

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view, which is then valuable in
what the whole can create.

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All right.
So that's basically the system

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we are in individuated units of
consciousness.

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One of those individual piece
the system was not the again I

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had another plateau, let's put
it that way had another plateau

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of growing up.
So it it needed a a better, more

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consequential virtual reality.
It created the first virtual

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reality, which was just
communication protocols, OK?

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And so it could communicate with
its little, you know,

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individuated units and they
could communicate with each

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other.
And that was a virtual reality.

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A virtual reality in a
information system is basically

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a rule set if you define a rule
set.

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And you can define initial
conditions too, if you want.

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But if you define a rule set
that forms a virtual reality,

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everybody that's in that virtual
reality has to abide by that

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rule set first, virtual reality
communication protocols next.

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Virtual reality had to be
something that was more than

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just a big chat room, which is
what they had with the first

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virtual reality was this monster
chat room.

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So that you can't grow very much
with that.

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The choices you make don't
matter a whole lot.

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So now what do we mean?
What is it about these choices?

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Well, the choices you make will
reflect that quality of your

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consciousness, which is the same
as that level of entropy of your

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consciousness.
So you need to make choices that

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lower the entropy of your
consciousness, because the whole

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system is evolving by lowering.
You know, the entropy of its

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consciousness.
Indeed.

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That's why we're here, because
we're part of the system

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strategy for lowering its own
entropy.

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That's why it had to create us.
OK, so then here we are, you and

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I, Tev and Tom, and we are
avatars.

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Our bodies are avatars.
Our consciousness is the player

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is a piece of consciousness, an
individual unit of

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consciousness.
Who is playing this human

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avatar?
The human avatar is this next,

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you know, represents this next
virtual reality I was talking

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about, OK, how does how does
that happen?

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Does the system program a big
virtual reality like ours?

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No, that's way too hard.
And it wouldn't be.

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It wouldn't hold together, it
wouldn't be consistent if it was

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just programmed.
So it's evolved.

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It started with a set of initial
conditions and you'll you'll

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kind of see The Big Bang in this
set of initial conditions, which

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is a ball of plasma, you know,
high pressure, high

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temperatures, a rule set like
gravitation and and you know,

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forces and so on.
The rule set we call physics,

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basic physics.
Then it punches the run button

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and lets the initial conditions
change according to the rule

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set.
And then it just lets that go

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and evolve however it does, and
we end up with our universe and

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eventually us.
And the whole point of this was

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to provide a new virtual reality
where consciousness had more

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consequential choices, choices
that would help it lower its

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entropy by bigger steps than
just the tiny little steps that

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it was able to get out of a big
chat room.

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So that was the point of it.
And then we.

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We individuated units of
consciousness.

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We we partition off a piece of
our self, which I call a free

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will awareness unit.
And that's the piece that logs

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on to play a human that has
evolved inside this big virtual

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reality that that the system has
evolved for us to play in and

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make choices in all right now,
as everybody knows the choices

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we have here.
Aren't trivial, you know, these

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choices are life and death and
very important to us.

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You know, we, we, you know, have
spouses, we have children, you

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know, we have to eat, we need to
find shelter.

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There's things that are are very
critical to us even existing

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there and not and not dying and
therefore being thrown out of

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the virtual reality.
So here we are.

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Pieces of consciousness, you
know, my individuated unit of

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consciousness is basically
having this conversation with

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your individuated unit of
consciousness using two avatars,

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you know, your body, my body.
So that's the way it works.

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Now that's simple enough.
But there are a lot of logical

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consequences of what I've just
said, you know, there's you can

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say, OK, I follow you, you know?
Consciousness is fundamental.

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Everything else is derived out
of consciousness.

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Our reality, our universe, our
physical universe is a virtual

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reality created by consciousness
in order to serve the

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consciousness systems need for
evolution.

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Because like anything you can
evolve and continue to evolve

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more, or you can de evolve and
eventually all your bits are

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random and you don't have an
information system anymore.

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So it's basically evolve or die.
You can't stay in the middle

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because that's that's unstable.
You can't just hang in the

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middle between the two.
You can dither around in the

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middle, but eventually you're
going to end up de evolving or

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evolving because the more you
evolve the easier it is to

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evolve more.
The more you de evolve, the

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easier it is to de evolve more.
Those two things are both slopes

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that's you that's you slide
down.

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So just trying to maintain a
balance between them.

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Well, maybe could do that for a
while, but it's not a good long

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term strategy.
Eventually you're going to end

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up on one slope or the other and
you know you're going to, you're

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going to, you're going to either
die or continue on.

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So the system wants to live, it
wants to continue on.

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So that's another thing that
motivates it.

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So it wants to lower its
entropy.

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Now, lots of logical
consequences, which is what

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we're going to talk about today,
I think.

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Logical consequences.
So that only took me 15 minutes.

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So that was good.
Yeah, I did actually.

229
00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:09,600
Really.
I did actually really well

230
00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:11,400
there.
Funny thing Tom is, is that our

231
00:14:11,400 --> 00:14:14,040
conversation the last time was 3
1/2 hours, but we could have

232
00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:16,240
gone on for much longer.
I think the only thing that

233
00:14:16,240 --> 00:14:19,360
stopped us was the fact that I
had to stop because it was past

234
00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:22,480
midnight and our times
differences are so vast.

235
00:14:22,480 --> 00:14:25,520
So had that not been the case, I
think we could have spoken for

236
00:14:25,520 --> 00:14:26,600
hours.
It could have went on for.

237
00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:28,040
Five hours?
Sure.

238
00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:30,360
Sure.
So now we'll get into some of

239
00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:33,280
the, you know, the the basically
logical consequences.

240
00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:37,560
But let me just say the obvious
one is that, you know,

241
00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:41,800
consciousness is non physical to
this reality.

242
00:14:41,800 --> 00:14:44,520
Well that's just the nature of a
virtual reality.

243
00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:49,280
If you're an elf in the World of
Warcraft, the computer that's

244
00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:53,240
computing that is non physical
to the elf, you know to that

245
00:14:53,240 --> 00:14:58,720
World of Warcraft world the.
The computer has to be someplace

246
00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:01,200
else.
It can't be inside the World of

247
00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:03,200
Warcraft.
It can't be part of that virtual

248
00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:04,720
reality.
It has to be outside the virtual

249
00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:06,000
reality.
And when it's outside the

250
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,760
virtual reality then if you're a
character in the virtual

251
00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:13,680
reality, it's non physical and
the player which makes all the

252
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:19,080
choices for the avatar, that too
has to be, you know, outside of

253
00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:22,760
the physical reality.
So what that tells us is that

254
00:15:22,760 --> 00:15:26,640
consciousness is non physical.
This is a virtual reality.

255
00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:31,880
Consciousness is the only thing
that is fundamental, the only

256
00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:37,800
thing that's real.
And information is the only

257
00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:40,640
thing that can create something
real information.

258
00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,480
And consciousness creates
reality.

259
00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,560
Those two things together,
information given to a

260
00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:50,000
consciousness creates reality.
OK.

261
00:15:50,000 --> 00:15:53,920
And so then I would go on to say
there's nothing more real than

262
00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:57,360
information.
That's as real as it gets

263
00:15:57,600 --> 00:16:01,560
information, you know.
So what are the consequences?

264
00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:03,840
Well, there's lots of
consequences to this.

265
00:16:04,080 --> 00:16:07,640
OK, so now we're two individual
units of consciousness,

266
00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,320
actually, two free will
awareness units having a having

267
00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:16,400
a chat with each other.
And this body only has to be,

268
00:16:16,920 --> 00:16:20,920
only has to be rendered.
For you to see it and look and

269
00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:24,200
see that I'm here, it doesn't
have to be rendered that there's

270
00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:26,560
oxygen in the room because you
can't see oxygen.

271
00:16:26,920 --> 00:16:30,120
It doesn't have to be rendered
that I have a brain or a heart

272
00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,840
or a circulatory system or a
liver or anything else.

273
00:16:32,840 --> 00:16:34,200
None of that needs to be
rendered.

274
00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:37,880
The only thing that has to be
rendered is my exterior and your

275
00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:41,600
exterior and the motion, the
things that we we do.

276
00:16:42,200 --> 00:16:46,720
OK, so the rendering.
Isn't as big a problem as one

277
00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:49,320
might think.
Like any other virtual reality,

278
00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:54,560
you only you only render what
the player can see or fear or

279
00:16:54,960 --> 00:16:58,720
you know, smell or taste.
You know you've got your

280
00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:03,040
sensors.
You only have to render what the

281
00:17:03,040 --> 00:17:07,160
other players can sense.
OK, so that's one thing.

282
00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:12,359
So our body is a virtual body.
There is no brain.

283
00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:15,000
It's a virtual brain.
The brain doesn't remember or

284
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:18,240
process anything.
The brain's not even rendered.

285
00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:20,839
You know, unless somebody cuts
your head open.

286
00:17:20,839 --> 00:17:23,480
Then it has to render a brain,
because now that's something you

287
00:17:23,480 --> 00:17:26,640
can see or smell and taste, you
know, taste that.

288
00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:30,920
That's gross in any way.
The avatars of neurosurgeons

289
00:17:30,960 --> 00:17:33,080
probably see the most rendered
brains in that case.

290
00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:38,080
Yes, they probably do.
None of those things are

291
00:17:38,080 --> 00:17:40,520
actually rendered.
We are pieces of consciousness

292
00:17:40,520 --> 00:17:42,080
now.
That means that we're immortal.

293
00:17:42,520 --> 00:17:44,560
Consciousness doesn't die.
Body dies.

294
00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:47,760
But consciousness is the player.
When your elf dies, you don't

295
00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:51,040
have to quit the game forever.
You go get back in the game.

296
00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:54,000
Well, we do too.
And the reason we have to get

297
00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:58,400
back in the game is evolving.
Lowering our entropy requires

298
00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:01,040
that we change who we are.
We have to make ourselves a

299
00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:04,120
lower entropy being.
It's not about our behavior,

300
00:18:04,360 --> 00:18:10,200
it's about who we are.
It's not about acting, kind,

301
00:18:10,200 --> 00:18:12,280
say.
It's about being kind.

302
00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:14,640
And those two things are very
different.

303
00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:19,880
So it's not easy.
So when you drop out of the game

304
00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:23,200
because your body dies or you
get run over by a truck or

305
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:26,640
something happens, well, you
have to get back in the game, so

306
00:18:26,640 --> 00:18:30,880
you get another you.
Your IUOCS, you know, takes

307
00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,440
that.
Old Partition down reintegrates

308
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:37,840
all that part of that computer,
puts a new partition down and

309
00:18:37,840 --> 00:18:40,640
starts to log on to some other
being.

310
00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:45,920
And when it does that, it logs
on with no intellectual data,

311
00:18:46,120 --> 00:18:51,600
only with the amount of quality
of consciousness that that that

312
00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:54,320
IUOC has learned up to that
point.

313
00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:59,200
So the whole point of this game
is to learn to grow up to lower

314
00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:03,920
your entropy and.
I'll just because we did it last

315
00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:10,080
time, I'll just say that we can
logically show that the optimal

316
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:18,640
way for a the optimal way for a
social system to evolve and we

317
00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:21,720
are a social system now, there's
lots of us interacting with each

318
00:19:21,720 --> 00:19:25,400
other with free will.
That optimal way is that those

319
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:30,240
interactions be cooperative.
But these interactions, those

320
00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:36,360
interactions are based on
caring, on helping on, you know,

321
00:19:36,360 --> 00:19:39,520
positive things, not negative
things.

322
00:19:40,120 --> 00:19:44,240
So I call that the love side.
So our whole point of being here

323
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:47,440
in this, in this virtual reality
is to lower our entropy.

324
00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:50,440
And the way we do that is to
care about each other, to

325
00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:54,760
cooperate, to connect.
And yes, that's not just me

326
00:19:54,760 --> 00:19:57,000
trying to.
Feel warm and fuzzy.

327
00:19:57,000 --> 00:20:01,080
That is a logical conclusion.
You know, It's one of those, one

328
00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:05,720
of those logical conclusions
from what I I told you.

329
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:09,000
But you can find that last
time's stuff.

330
00:20:09,000 --> 00:20:12,040
We won't do that again.
So that gives us purpose.

331
00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:14,880
What's our purpose here?
It's to grow up.

332
00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,960
It's to lower our entropy, which
means it's to become love, to

333
00:20:17,960 --> 00:20:23,560
care, to cooperate, to be, you
know, asked the question, what

334
00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:25,000
can I do?
How can I help?

335
00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:30,800
Rather than what's in it for me
and you know how can I get get

336
00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:35,840
the most by doing the least.
You know that's that's going the

337
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:37,800
wrong way.
That's on the fear side which is

338
00:20:37,800 --> 00:20:40,240
the opposite of love is the is
the fear side.

339
00:20:40,760 --> 00:20:43,360
It's not love versus hate.
It's love versus fear.

340
00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:48,520
Hate is just a a an offshoot of
of fear.

341
00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:54,200
So in any case that's just one
of the logical consequences.

342
00:20:54,200 --> 00:20:56,400
But I'm I'm pointing those out
because they're kind of the big

343
00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:58,760
things and we're going to get
into the more detailed things

344
00:20:59,160 --> 00:21:01,160
later.
So you are a piece of

345
00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:04,920
consciousness and you are
immortal and you have multiple

346
00:21:04,920 --> 00:21:09,560
lifetimes, but each time you
only take your quality with you

347
00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:12,560
into that next life and not your
intellect.

348
00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:15,600
And there's a lot of good
logical reasons that it has to

349
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:17,920
be that way.
So that's enough.

350
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:19,800
I think we kind of have the
basic thing.

351
00:21:19,800 --> 00:21:20,760
Who am I?
Who are you?

352
00:21:20,760 --> 00:21:23,640
Why are we here?
What the system was made of?

353
00:21:23,680 --> 00:21:28,880
And and we'll just start off
fresh from from that point.

354
00:21:29,120 --> 00:21:31,560
So let's so for for all of those
who need to watch that they

355
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:32,960
should.
And then obviously read your

356
00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,840
book, your trilogy, Theory of
everything, get a deeper

357
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:37,800
understanding and then you can
come into this conversation with

358
00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:41,200
a bit more context.
Now this theory, unlike other

359
00:21:41,200 --> 00:21:45,360
idealists, you even mentioned
Bernardo Castro, Donald Hoffman,

360
00:21:45,360 --> 00:21:47,600
etcetera.
There are many idealists out

361
00:21:47,600 --> 00:21:51,360
there at this point, but your
your theory you're able to touch

362
00:21:51,360 --> 00:21:55,160
on topics that they tend to sway
away from and they don't like to

363
00:21:55,160 --> 00:21:57,440
talk about out of body
experiences near death.

364
00:21:58,440 --> 00:22:01,600
Sort of paranormal things.
So anything that's considered

365
00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:05,160
paranormal in that in that
sense, this theory obviously

366
00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:08,480
allows you to touch on topics
that they don't like to and I

367
00:22:08,480 --> 00:22:09,840
think let's go through a lot of
them.

368
00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:13,640
You already briefly touched on
death and and this process of

369
00:22:13,920 --> 00:22:16,160
almost like a reincarnation,
you're just sort of rebooting

370
00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:19,000
into a different avatar.
Let's touch on what happens

371
00:22:19,040 --> 00:22:22,960
after death.
And along those lines, how does

372
00:22:22,960 --> 00:22:25,200
your theory explain sort of
reincarnation within this

373
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:28,400
context?
And also near death experiences.

374
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:36,120
OK, well death is part of the
rule set here.

375
00:22:36,120 --> 00:22:39,200
Remember we had initial
conditions in a rule set and the

376
00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:43,520
way the rule set works is we
grow old and the body dies.

377
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,200
Or it's a dangerous place really
to be.

378
00:22:46,480 --> 00:22:49,320
We may get, you know, killed
some other way.

379
00:22:49,320 --> 00:22:52,280
We may die some other way.
Can get a disease.

380
00:22:52,600 --> 00:22:56,840
You can get, you know, killed by
force, whether it's being run

381
00:22:56,840 --> 00:22:59,400
over by something or whether
you're in a fight or whatever.

382
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:02,240
So the human body is going to
die.

383
00:23:03,040 --> 00:23:06,680
And really that's a good thing
because what we're doing is

384
00:23:06,680 --> 00:23:09,120
trying to lower our entropy and
grow.

385
00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:12,720
And as we get old, we kind of
get that been there, done that

386
00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:15,880
attitude and growing gets a
little slower.

387
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:19,160
We kind of get settled in our
ways and we think we know just

388
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:20,840
about everything that there is
to know.

389
00:23:21,400 --> 00:23:24,160
And we're happy with what we
know and we don't care much

390
00:23:24,160 --> 00:23:27,680
about what we don't know.
And that means the learning kind

391
00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:29,800
of gets slower and slower and
slower.

392
00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,480
So what happens when that, you
know, when you get an

393
00:23:32,480 --> 00:23:36,080
inefficiency like that as well,
you need to reboot, you need to

394
00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:38,960
say, well, OK, we've got enough
out of that character, we're not

395
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:40,280
going to get much more out of
them.

396
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:45,320
So let's go to another because
when you're very young you're,

397
00:23:45,600 --> 00:23:51,600
you know, you're you're very
much open to everything because

398
00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:55,920
you don't know yet all the
things that are impossible.

399
00:23:56,200 --> 00:23:58,720
So everything's kind of possible
when you're young.

400
00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:01,880
And a lot of those things that
your people will tell you are

401
00:24:01,880 --> 00:24:03,680
impossible really aren't
impossible.

402
00:24:03,680 --> 00:24:06,120
This, those are just beliefs
that those people have.

403
00:24:06,120 --> 00:24:09,120
You see, that's how we make
progress, You know, we grow, we

404
00:24:09,120 --> 00:24:13,360
do things that are better.
So OK, let's say you are an

405
00:24:13,360 --> 00:24:17,280
individual and your your body
dies.

406
00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:23,000
When your body dies, then that
free will awareness unit is done

407
00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:24,880
right.
The free will awareness unit was

408
00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:28,080
just that piece of the
individual unit of consciousness

409
00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:33,000
that was logged on to play all
the choices for that body, make

410
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:36,040
all the choices So that free
will awareness unit, now that

411
00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:39,040
partition comes down and it
starts to reintegrate with the

412
00:24:39,040 --> 00:24:42,880
individual unit of
consciousness, the individual

413
00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:45,000
itself.
Their awareness goes from I'm

414
00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,440
here, I'm alive to oh, where am
I?

415
00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:52,880
What's what's going on?
You find yourself not in the old

416
00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:57,080
reality anymore, but some other
reality at that point.

417
00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:01,240
There is another virtual reality
called the transition reality.

418
00:25:01,720 --> 00:25:04,520
I just made that name up because
that's basically what it does.

419
00:25:04,920 --> 00:25:07,880
And that's a reality that's been
designed to help people

420
00:25:07,880 --> 00:25:11,960
transition from 1:00, you know,
experience to another.

421
00:25:11,960 --> 00:25:15,000
I call those experience packets,
1 experience packet to another

422
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,520
experience packet.
Other people call that

423
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:21,240
reincarnation.
I like to avoid all the words

424
00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:24,880
and terminology that has to do
with anybody's religion or other

425
00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:29,800
ideas because, you know, a lot
of people hold those ideas real

426
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,320
sacred.
They get upset if you say things

427
00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:34,960
about them that they don't agree
with and it just creates a lot

428
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:39,760
of trouble.
So I I got my own terms so we're

429
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,880
talking about the experience
packets that you that you have

430
00:25:43,880 --> 00:25:45,280
and.
Just also another thing is, I

431
00:25:45,280 --> 00:25:48,280
know you you often say that you
also don't want this to be

432
00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,080
entwined with theology.
You want people to actually you

433
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:54,320
sometimes name these things
relatively silly names.

434
00:25:54,320 --> 00:25:56,360
You sometimes like to actually
do that on purpose.

435
00:25:57,320 --> 00:26:00,560
I do that on purpose so that
people won't get that serious

436
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:01,960
about it.
I don't want to start a new

437
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,560
theology.
What I'd like to do is help

438
00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,360
correct an old theology, you
know that would be better.

439
00:26:09,800 --> 00:26:11,600
I think that even though you
don't want to start one, it's

440
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:15,040
probably going to happen.
I hope not.

441
00:26:15,560 --> 00:26:18,400
I hope not.
I I try very hard not to make

442
00:26:18,400 --> 00:26:21,920
that happen.
Like you say the the entity

443
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:26,880
that's kind of in charge of this
part of the of the non physical

444
00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:29,600
space and consciousness.
So I named him the Big Cheese,

445
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:32,480
just because I thought that was
funny enough that people

446
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,000
wouldn't start to get down on
their knees and, you know, pray

447
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:37,920
to the Big Cheese.
It's just too silly to to to do

448
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:40,680
that.
So I I make up these names.

449
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:47,520
But a lot of people who do
understand my Big toe very

450
00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:51,920
deeply and they're also
religious, then they do see the

451
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:56,400
larger conscious system as God.
And for them it's like, wow,

452
00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:59,520
great, now I know really what
God is and where God comes from.

453
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:02,880
And so it it solves a lot of
problems for them because the,

454
00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:09,160
you know, the the God thing is
is all kind of magic and and you

455
00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:12,960
know, assumptions.
It doesn't have much solidity to

456
00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,640
it from a logical viewpoint.
Well, now suddenly it's logical

457
00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:20,200
and it makes sense.
So there are people who, you

458
00:27:20,200 --> 00:27:24,080
know, think that the larger
conscious system is God.

459
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:27,480
Well, it is the creator.
We are a piece of it.

460
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:29,760
You know it.
We're made in its image.

461
00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:32,160
We're a piece of consciousness.
You know, you can fill in a lot

462
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:36,400
of those, those little blanks,
and it works rather well.

463
00:27:37,120 --> 00:27:40,880
So in any case, people do that.
I don't.

464
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:44,160
I avoid the word God because
again, it comes with all kinds

465
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:48,960
of emotional energy and there
just isn't any point in ever

466
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:53,440
arguing with emotion or arguing
with believers.

467
00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:58,320
Those are arguments that that
have no resolution and never

468
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,240
converge, so there's just no
point to have them.

469
00:28:01,240 --> 00:28:04,920
So I try to avoid them by not
using words that will start

470
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:08,360
those kind of arguments.
So anyway, it's just the larger

471
00:28:08,360 --> 00:28:13,160
consciousness system.
Now I one time did sit down with

472
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:16,000
a couple of theologians.
They both had their pH.

473
00:28:16,000 --> 00:28:18,640
DS in theology.
And I asked them to say what are

474
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,160
all the attributes of God?
And you write them down, and

475
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:23,080
they did.
They wrote them all.

476
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:25,600
They wrote down about 6-7 things
that they said were the

477
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:30,040
attributes of God.
And all of those attributes

478
00:28:30,040 --> 00:28:32,560
applied directly to the larger
consciousness system.

479
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:37,320
OK, but these attributes were
not denominational.

480
00:28:37,320 --> 00:28:41,560
They weren't dogmatic things.
They were just general things,

481
00:28:41,560 --> 00:28:44,440
you see.
And so in that case, you know,

482
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,920
they'll see us in God kind of
are are a match up.

483
00:28:49,280 --> 00:28:53,520
But there's a lot of people that
have a lot of of individual kind

484
00:28:53,520 --> 00:28:57,600
of dogmatic things wrapped
around religion.

485
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:02,520
And I don't go there because
MBT, my big toe has nothing that

486
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:05,320
you need to believe.
Matter of fact, belief is the

487
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,760
enemy in my in my scheme of
things, if you believe

488
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:13,920
something, that belief will
limit your ability to find out

489
00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:16,200
for sure what's going on.
You just believe it.

490
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:20,760
You stop asking questions.
So you know in MBT it's believe

491
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:24,000
nothing, be skeptical of
everything.

492
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,440
And that includes everything I
say too.

493
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:30,160
You have to be skeptical of it.
If it's not your, if it's not

494
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:32,720
your experience, then it's not
really your truth.

495
00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:38,440
So you know, I implore everyone
to be skeptical and find out for

496
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:41,120
yourself whether there's truth
in this or not.

497
00:29:41,360 --> 00:29:43,000
And there's many ways you can do
that.

498
00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:48,680
So you know, and I I give people
tools to help them do that.

499
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:51,920
You can find them at my website.
So that's.

500
00:29:52,480 --> 00:29:54,760
Let's go.
Let's go back to the death, Tom,

501
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:59,600
to see OK, so you die.
You end up in the transition

502
00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:03,400
reality.
Now the transition reality, the

503
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,040
first thing that it wants to
accomplish when somebody who's

504
00:30:07,040 --> 00:30:12,160
just died shows up, it wants to
make them relax and let go and

505
00:30:12,160 --> 00:30:15,840
not be so hysterical about am I
in heaven or I'm in hell or

506
00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:22,960
what's going on here, You know,
So mostly it's just to comfort

507
00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:27,320
and to get people to let go.
Now, the thing that helps people

508
00:30:27,320 --> 00:30:30,840
letting go from the past
experience is that their their

509
00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:34,600
past life that they just exited
starts to fade.

510
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:38,880
Just like dreams fade the
instant after they died, they

511
00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:42,280
remember every detail of it.
You know, a minute later it's

512
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:46,120
kind of fuzzy, You know, 3 or 4
minutes later they only got the

513
00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,640
highlights.
And you know, by 5 minutes later

514
00:30:49,480 --> 00:30:52,680
it's kind of, you know, yeah, I
remember having that dream, but

515
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:54,840
you don't relate to it that much
anymore.

516
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:57,880
You know, that's the way dreams
are and that's the way your past

517
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:01,040
life is.
So they just want you to kind of

518
00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:07,280
be still and connect and be
happy and be positive just long

519
00:31:07,280 --> 00:31:12,240
enough for all those those past
life memories to disappear like

520
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:14,280
a dream.
Why do you think that happens?

521
00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:19,400
Well, what that what that
happens is because all of that

522
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:22,320
past life stuff brings a lot of
fear with it.

523
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:30,160
There's a lot of fears there and
trying to deal with all of that

524
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:32,160
when there's really nothing you
can do about it.

525
00:31:32,200 --> 00:31:34,640
It's over, right?
Oh, I left my children.

526
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:35,800
Who's going to take care of
them?

527
00:31:35,800 --> 00:31:37,920
Oh, I did this.
Oh, I did that, you know.

528
00:31:37,920 --> 00:31:40,680
Oh, you know, am I in heaven or
I'm in hell?

529
00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:42,080
Am I going to be punished
forever?

530
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:46,040
So you you have all this junk
that people are struggling with,

531
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:49,040
are afraid of, and they're
fearful because this is the

532
00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:51,040
unknown now.
So they're in the unknown.

533
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:52,680
And people are kind of afraid of
the unknown.

534
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:56,120
So you have to kind of comfort
them as they show up.

535
00:31:56,520 --> 00:32:00,280
And the way the system does that
is somebody, you know, it's like

536
00:32:00,280 --> 00:32:02,680
the Walmart greeter.
I don't know if that makes any

537
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,600
sense to you in South Africa.
But, you know, here we have

538
00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:07,960
these, these big stores and
there's somebody stands inside

539
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:09,680
the door.
Welcome to Walmart, you know.

540
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:11,200
Yeah.
What are you looking for?

541
00:32:11,200 --> 00:32:14,440
Oh, hardware's over there, you
know, that kind of a person.

542
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:19,280
So you kind of have the greeters
there that welcome people to say

543
00:32:19,360 --> 00:32:21,160
everything's fine.
You're doing great.

544
00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,280
Yeah, You're going to.
You're going to, you know,

545
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:25,240
you're going to like it here,
whatever.

546
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:27,640
Just things to make people, oh,
really?

547
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,080
And they kind of look around and
everything looks clean and looks

548
00:32:30,080 --> 00:32:33,200
nice.
And then if the people who are a

549
00:32:33,200 --> 00:32:38,360
little more worried, the ones
that have more fear, then they

550
00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:41,200
get to see relatives.
Oh look, there's your Uncle Fred

551
00:32:41,200 --> 00:32:43,680
that died 10 years ago.
You know he's he's come here to

552
00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:45,720
greet you.
Well, it's not really their

553
00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:47,240
Uncle Fred.
That's just the.

554
00:32:50,920 --> 00:32:55,600
That's just the what a, a
representation of Uncle Fred

555
00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,160
from the database.
And we'll we later we'll talk

556
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,520
about what database and why do
we have a database and and so

557
00:33:02,520 --> 00:33:05,040
on.
But it's not really your Uncle

558
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:06,560
Fred.
Your Uncle Fred's gone off to

559
00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:08,960
some other other experienced
package.

560
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,120
You know he's not hanging around
just waiting for you to die so

561
00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:14,920
he can say hello.
Yeah, that just doesn't make any

562
00:33:14,920 --> 00:33:19,360
sense.
So Uncle Fred and Aunt Susie and

563
00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:23,000
lots of people, whoever you know
who's died, you know, they come

564
00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:24,960
and they tell you what a
wonderful place it is and you'll

565
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:29,080
do fine and and they greet you
and you relax and say, ah, well,

566
00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:31,480
this seems like a nice place.
I guess I'm not going to hell.

567
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:35,160
I guess this is going to be OK
And then you relax and that's

568
00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,480
the whole point of it.
Sometimes, depending on your

569
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:42,880
level of stress, they will just
tell you to do things that are

570
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:48,160
just busy work in order to get
you to just pass some time by

571
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:51,400
and relax and let go.
So often they'll say, well, OK,

572
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:53,920
yeah, we have you right here.
What's your name?

573
00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:56,320
You know, Joe Smith.
Oh yeah, Joe, we've been waiting

574
00:33:56,320 --> 00:33:57,520
for you.
You know, go over there.

575
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:01,240
See that that Lady over there?
Go see that line.

576
00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,480
She's processing people and go
stand in that line.

577
00:34:03,480 --> 00:34:05,720
And when she gets to you, she'll
tell you what to do next.

578
00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,880
Well, there is no point.
The lady's not doing anything at

579
00:34:09,880 --> 00:34:13,120
all.
She's just creating a line so

580
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:17,320
that people have something to do
for a while and they don't get

581
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:21,080
panicked or upset or.
OK, what's next?

582
00:34:21,280 --> 00:34:25,159
What am I supposed to do?
You know, is this the, you know,

583
00:34:25,159 --> 00:34:28,159
this is the eternal you know, do
I need to know how to play a

584
00:34:28,159 --> 00:34:30,239
harp?
You know what's going on here.

585
00:34:30,600 --> 00:34:33,120
So they it just gives them
something to do.

586
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:37,960
It takes up their time.
And if they're still stressed by

587
00:34:37,960 --> 00:34:40,320
the time they get to the front
of the line, well she'll tell

588
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,960
them to go over.
Now she has to see the guy over

589
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:44,800
there.
You know, he's, he handles

590
00:34:44,800 --> 00:34:46,320
people like you.
Yeah.

591
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:50,960
It's just buying more time.
Well, eventually people get over

592
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:53,560
it.
They forget entirely about their

593
00:34:53,560 --> 00:34:56,199
past life.
They don't really have any

594
00:34:56,199 --> 00:34:57,960
remember of it.
They don't have any of the cares

595
00:34:57,960 --> 00:35:00,840
or the worries about their
children or you know, what

596
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:02,960
happened to the, you know, they
had a wreck in a car.

597
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:06,000
You know, am I the only one that
didn't survive or what?

598
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:11,080
You know, all that stuff just
kind of goes away and they're

599
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:13,400
assured that everything's fine.
Oh, yeah, your children are

600
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:16,760
fine, you know, You know, that
kind of thing.

601
00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:21,080
And eventually they'll get to a
point where they will get kind

602
00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:24,440
of bored and they're wonder,
well, what's next, You know?

603
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:26,720
OK, So what do I do?
I've been standing around here

604
00:35:26,720 --> 00:35:29,320
for a long time.
Let's go to wherever the action

605
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:33,440
is and somebody will talk to you
about the next life you're going

606
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:36,600
to have and the kind of things
you should work on and the kind

607
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:39,520
of things you didn't do very
well last time that you need to

608
00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:43,720
work on.
And if you can't understand

609
00:35:43,720 --> 00:35:46,680
that, they may give you a little
life review of.

610
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:50,000
It's like you sit down and watch
this movie of your past life and

611
00:35:50,000 --> 00:35:53,800
it's the movie of you making
very poor choices and you'll

612
00:35:53,800 --> 00:35:56,080
skip from 1 poor choice to the
next.

613
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,760
And, you know, being rude, being
being unpleasant, being

614
00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:02,680
self-centered, you know, all
these things you're trying to

615
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:05,840
outgrow, 'cause remember, we're
trying to grow toward love.

616
00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:09,200
And you'll look at that and you
go, oh, yeah, I guess I do need

617
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:14,080
to, you know, work on that.
And then you, you get another,

618
00:36:14,280 --> 00:36:18,480
you get offered another place to
go when you're ready.

619
00:36:19,040 --> 00:36:22,160
And you can always say, no, I
don't like that one.

620
00:36:22,240 --> 00:36:23,560
They'll tell you a little about
it.

621
00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:27,640
And if they'll give you a
different one, you know, so and

622
00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:29,800
you can kind of say, well, what
I'd like next time.

623
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,480
I want to be filthy rich.
I want to be born into a family

624
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,360
that's got a billion dollars in
the bank.

625
00:36:35,960 --> 00:36:39,520
And you know, because last time,
all those mistakes I made, I

626
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:40,760
just made him because I was
poor.

627
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:42,720
It wasn't me, you know, I
didn't.

628
00:36:42,720 --> 00:36:45,160
It's not that my quality of
consciousness isn't good, It's

629
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:47,600
just that I had a really bad
situation.

630
00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:51,800
Well, you know, they point out
that that's they show you this

631
00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:54,560
this past life review where that
really wasn't true.

632
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:56,160
It wasn't so much that you were
poor.

633
00:36:56,160 --> 00:36:59,160
It's just as you were negative.
But they may give you that and

634
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:02,680
you may be born into a family
that has a billion dollars and

635
00:37:02,920 --> 00:37:04,960
typically you don't do much
better.

636
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:08,440
You know, you become a monster.
You know, you become, you know,

637
00:37:08,440 --> 00:37:11,400
you you run over a lot of other
people because now you have

638
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:16,200
power and you're still nasty and
not doing making good choices

639
00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:19,640
and so on.
And you may de evolve if you

640
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:23,480
make enough bad choices.
And with all that power and not

641
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:27,120
much growth, you're likely to de
evolve if you've got that much

642
00:37:27,120 --> 00:37:29,160
power.
So you'll come back out from

643
00:37:29,160 --> 00:37:33,760
that and you'll be two or three
steps behind where you were last

644
00:37:33,760 --> 00:37:36,880
time because you've made a lot
of terrible choices.

645
00:37:37,360 --> 00:37:40,680
And then you thought, oh, being
rich wasn't such a good idea.

646
00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:45,160
You know that that set me back
because I could really mess

647
00:37:45,160 --> 00:37:49,000
things up and make a lot of
entropy, you know, raise entropy

648
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:53,320
a lot with all that power.
So anyhow, this is the process

649
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,320
of learning.
So you always have free will,

650
00:37:56,320 --> 00:37:58,800
you can always say no, you can
always wait.

651
00:37:59,200 --> 00:38:02,360
There are other places besides
this virtual reality that you

652
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:05,680
can go to, but most people just
come back to the same one

653
00:38:05,680 --> 00:38:07,000
because they already know how it
works.

654
00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:10,200
Here you go to a different one
and it's a completely different

655
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:14,400
ball game.
So most people come back to the

656
00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:18,080
ones that they're used to.
So anyway that's kind of what

657
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:20,200
happens when you die.
Then you go back, you get

658
00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:24,440
another body, right?
The your IUOC puts another

659
00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:27,240
petition down, creates another
free will awareness unit that

660
00:38:27,240 --> 00:38:31,680
just has the level of of growth
that you've made-up to this

661
00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:33,680
point.
So your your growth is

662
00:38:33,680 --> 00:38:36,400
cumulative.
You keep growing and then you go

663
00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:39,520
off and now you're an infant
again.

664
00:38:40,480 --> 00:38:45,600
You may, you may go into that.
You may log on to that fetus

665
00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:49,640
even before it's born, because
as long as there are things to

666
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,120
trigger your senses, then you're
getting information.

667
00:38:54,360 --> 00:38:57,880
So, you know, maybe it's just
light and feeling and you're in

668
00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:01,040
a squishy, fluid sack and, you
know, maybe you can do a little

669
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:03,880
punching on the inside of mom or
whatever, you know?

670
00:39:03,880 --> 00:39:07,280
But you, you can hear voices,
hear music.

671
00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:10,760
You get a sense of attitudes and
feelings.

672
00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:13,400
You know, are people nice and
happy or are people sad and

673
00:39:13,400 --> 00:39:16,000
angry?
So all of that stuff will affect

674
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:18,840
you somewhat.
And then you're born and so on.

675
00:39:18,840 --> 00:39:21,520
Life goes until you die, and
then the whole thing recycles

676
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:24,520
again.
So that's basically the way life

677
00:39:24,520 --> 00:39:27,640
works.
If you're very frightened when

678
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:30,480
you die, it'll take a little
longer for you to process

679
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,080
through the, you know, relaxing
and get over.

680
00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:36,640
It pays if you're not, if you're
an old hand at that, you've

681
00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:39,280
been, you've been around through
the process enough times that

682
00:39:39,280 --> 00:39:41,120
you need it, then then you skip
steps.

683
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:42,720
You don't.
You don't have to go stand in a

684
00:39:42,720 --> 00:39:45,360
line or do any of that kind of
stuff because that's not really

685
00:39:45,360 --> 00:39:47,800
important.
You know, you go straight to the

686
00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:51,200
to the place where you start
thinking about what you need to

687
00:39:51,200 --> 00:39:53,000
do next.
What are the kinds of things

688
00:39:53,000 --> 00:39:54,680
that you failed to do well last
time?

689
00:39:54,680 --> 00:39:59,640
And how can you work on those
and and set your mind to kind of

690
00:39:59,640 --> 00:40:02,800
focusing on those things so that
when you have your next

691
00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:06,200
incarnation?
You, you'll tend to be aware of

692
00:40:06,200 --> 00:40:11,440
those things anyhow.
That's the way you know life and

693
00:40:11,440 --> 00:40:15,840
death is.
And it's the same consciousness,

694
00:40:16,080 --> 00:40:20,680
just multiple incarnations.
And we have to have a lot of

695
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:24,040
variation in our in our
incarnation.

696
00:40:24,040 --> 00:40:26,720
Sometimes you need to be male,
sometimes female.

697
00:40:27,000 --> 00:40:31,680
Sometimes you know all the
races, you know white and black

698
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:34,320
and yellow and green and pink
and whatever there are.

699
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:38,480
You have to experience all of
those various cultures because

700
00:40:38,480 --> 00:40:41,160
all of that gives you different
perspectives and different

701
00:40:41,160 --> 00:40:44,000
choices to make.
You don't want to just get a

702
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:46,440
life where you make the same
kind of choices all the time.

703
00:40:46,440 --> 00:40:48,800
You know you're not going to
grow up much from that.

704
00:40:49,160 --> 00:40:52,760
You need lives that that give
you an array of different sorts

705
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:54,920
of choices in different
circumstances.

706
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,920
Which is why you don't take your
intellect along.

707
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:02,520
Because if you did, all you do
is try to gain the system.

708
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:04,760
Oh well, what choice should I
make here?

709
00:41:04,880 --> 00:41:07,360
Oh, yeah, I should.
I should do this.

710
00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:11,160
Well, that's the acting kind
instead of the being kind.

711
00:41:11,520 --> 00:41:14,600
That's not going to help you.
We don't want you to try to gain

712
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:19,520
the system you know you You need
to act out of who you are

713
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:23,000
sincerely out of the authentic.
You has to make the choice.

714
00:41:23,400 --> 00:41:27,520
Well, the way they authentic you
has to make the choice is that

715
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:30,280
all the intellectual part is
gone.

716
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:32,960
So what's left is the authentic
you.

717
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:37,480
So that's why you shouldn't.
You know that you don't want all

718
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:40,680
that knowledge.
Not only that, it would be

719
00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:44,720
ridiculously cumbersome if you
were aware.

720
00:41:44,920 --> 00:41:50,120
Oh, let's see.
I've had 20,000 wives and about

721
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:54,360
60,000 children, and I loved
every one of them dearly.

722
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:56,120
They were my whole reason for
living.

723
00:41:56,160 --> 00:42:00,840
And you know, you can't keep
track of all of that stuff

724
00:42:00,840 --> 00:42:03,640
because you're not just gonna be
two or three incarnations and

725
00:42:03,640 --> 00:42:05,280
now you're brilliant.
You know everything.

726
00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:09,680
You're gonna do this thousands
of times, so you need to let go

727
00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:12,320
of the past.
Start out with an authentic

728
00:42:13,120 --> 00:42:17,920
expression of who you are.
Then you have authentic choices,

729
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:20,600
and you can learn something from
authentic choice.

730
00:42:20,600 --> 00:42:22,640
You can't game the system
because you don't have any

731
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:27,040
information to game it with.
So that's why there's no user's

732
00:42:27,040 --> 00:42:30,520
manual or there's no that we
don't understand all this.

733
00:42:30,520 --> 00:42:34,880
When we come back, it's it's
better that we don't.

734
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:38,400
We're more authentic and we have
a higher probability of success

735
00:42:38,840 --> 00:42:44,320
if we just come in and we have
to make choices that express who

736
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:47,440
we are and then we have to live
with those consequences.

737
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:52,120
So one other thing I'd say about
that, that if you are growing up

738
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:55,080
lowering your entropy, you tend
to have a happy life.

739
00:42:55,360 --> 00:42:59,600
You tend to find satisfaction,
peace, You know, your life is

740
00:42:59,600 --> 00:43:02,000
very good.
You smile a lot.

741
00:43:02,520 --> 00:43:06,320
If you are not growing up, if
you are mostly in the fear

742
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:10,960
category and self-centered and
fearful, your life is miserable.

743
00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:14,440
It's always a struggle.
Everything seems to go wrong.

744
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,400
There's always the next hurdle
that's blocking you, that's in

745
00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:19,400
front of you.
You blame everything on

746
00:43:19,400 --> 00:43:22,920
everybody else except yourself.
You know that's the life you

747
00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:26,760
live and it's miserable.
It's it's painful.

748
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:30,280
So it's in.
Everybody's interested,

749
00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:33,760
actually.
Try, you know, to to level up in

750
00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:38,680
this game by by being kind and
being helpful and being caring

751
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:42,080
and getting rid of that
self-centered stuff.

752
00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:44,440
You know, get rid of that ego
that's all about you.

753
00:43:45,280 --> 00:43:47,640
Make it about other people.
Love is about other.

754
00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:52,080
Fear is about self.
So that's death.

755
00:43:52,680 --> 00:43:55,400
Within that goal directed
framework where you're

756
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:59,520
constantly coming back in order
to fulfill this, what happens

757
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:02,280
when you actually truly do
fulfill that and you reach that

758
00:44:02,280 --> 00:44:07,200
lowest entropic state where the
person is now embodies love in

759
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,720
that in the sense that you're
talking about?

760
00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:11,160
Well, there's a couple of issues
here.

761
00:44:11,160 --> 00:44:17,360
One, it's true that the more you
evolve, the easier it is to

762
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:19,920
evolve more.
So the steps you take tend to be

763
00:44:19,920 --> 00:44:23,920
bigger and bigger, so you get
there faster and faster as time

764
00:44:23,920 --> 00:44:26,760
goes on.
On the other hand, on the other

765
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:33,480
side of that coin, is that the
changes that you make are

766
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:37,360
changes really of refinement.
You know, if you're pretty good

767
00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:40,640
and you you've lost all those
crass, you know things, you

768
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:43,520
stop, you know, killing people.
If you stop beating your

769
00:44:43,520 --> 00:44:46,240
children, you know, and your
wife, you stop kicking the dog.

770
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:48,920
You know, if you've, if you've
kind of gotten over all those

771
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:52,160
crass things, well now you're
refining something that is

772
00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,080
already pretty good.
And those refinements come in

773
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:58,800
smaller and smaller increments,
so it's easier to learn more.

774
00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:03,200
But what you're learning more
now has to do with refining.

775
00:45:03,880 --> 00:45:05,400
You know, you're trying to lower
entropy.

776
00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:09,880
Well, one of the facts of life
is entropy never goes to 0.

777
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:15,200
You can't ever get it to zero.
You can approach zero, you can

778
00:45:15,200 --> 00:45:19,480
get asymptotic to 0 in math
language, but you never actually

779
00:45:19,480 --> 00:45:24,120
get to 0.
And you have to always work on

780
00:45:24,120 --> 00:45:27,960
it, because if you don't put
effort into work on it, if

781
00:45:27,960 --> 00:45:32,040
there's no energy put in, then
you start to backslide.

782
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:36,360
Entropy just starts to rise up
because you're not putting the

783
00:45:36,360 --> 00:45:39,080
effort to keep it down.
You know, that's the second law

784
00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:43,600
of thermodynamics.
You know that systems that are

785
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:47,160
not reversible.
You know, systems that evolve

786
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:52,160
and move and change, if there's
no energy put into them, they

787
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:55,760
automatically decay.
Everything has a shelf life,

788
00:45:55,880 --> 00:46:00,440
everything decays, even a even a
block of steel.

789
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:04,000
If you wait long enough, it'll
evaporate that steel.

790
00:46:05,000 --> 00:46:07,640
The block will get smaller and
smaller and smaller until it's

791
00:46:07,640 --> 00:46:08,920
gone.
Just like an ice cube.

792
00:46:09,280 --> 00:46:11,960
You know, you put an ice cube in
the freezer and you let it sit

793
00:46:11,960 --> 00:46:13,760
there long enough, the ice cube
is gone.

794
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:15,760
You know it sublimates into
water vapor.

795
00:46:17,160 --> 00:46:21,640
That's just because entropy.
Water vapor is a higher entropy

796
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:27,280
state than ice, you know, So
that's just the nature of

797
00:46:27,320 --> 00:46:30,400
reality, and it's the nature of
of consciousness as well.

798
00:46:30,720 --> 00:46:33,840
So you have to always be putting
effort in so you never get to

799
00:46:33,840 --> 00:46:37,200
the point where you say I'm
done, you know, I've gotten

800
00:46:37,200 --> 00:46:39,360
here.
You know, my entropy's really,

801
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:42,520
really low.
I can't, I can't lower it much

802
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:45,440
more except by tiny increments.
So I quit.

803
00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:49,880
Well, as soon as you quit, your
entropy starts going up again.

804
00:46:50,640 --> 00:46:53,280
Your your ego starts getting
bigger.

805
00:46:53,920 --> 00:46:55,400
You start feeling good about
yourself.

806
00:46:55,400 --> 00:46:58,680
Oh, I made it to the top.
I'm better than all those other

807
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:01,240
people you see now.
All that's just ego talking.

808
00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:05,880
That's not, you know, that's not
high quality, high quality.

809
00:47:05,880 --> 00:47:07,400
You don't put yourself above
others.

810
00:47:07,400 --> 00:47:09,000
You don't look down on other
people.

811
00:47:09,000 --> 00:47:12,400
You're not condescending.
All that's low quality, not high

812
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:17,200
quality.
So what you do instead is you

813
00:47:17,200 --> 00:47:19,120
decide that, well, what can I do
to help?

814
00:47:19,200 --> 00:47:23,400
It's not just about me.
You see, if it's just about you

815
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:25,920
and you've just been working on
lowering your entropy and now

816
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:27,960
you got it really low.
Yay, me.

817
00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:31,760
Well, that's all about you.
What have you given back?

818
00:47:31,760 --> 00:47:33,000
What?
How have you helped?

819
00:47:33,000 --> 00:47:34,960
How have you helped everybody
else succeed?

820
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:37,360
Oh, I haven't.
It's just all been about me.

821
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:40,800
Well, then you're not that grown
up, you see, you just think

822
00:47:40,800 --> 00:47:43,800
you're that grown up.
If it's all about you, then

823
00:47:44,360 --> 00:47:47,920
you've got a lot to learn yet.
So that's the point.

824
00:47:47,920 --> 00:47:52,080
So there really is no end.
You always can be helpful to

825
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:55,640
others.
You can always Incarnate back

826
00:47:55,640 --> 00:47:58,520
here in the situation.
And you don't have to be a big

827
00:47:58,520 --> 00:48:03,960
guru or, you know, lead you know
the masses to salvation or

828
00:48:03,960 --> 00:48:06,120
something.
All you have to be is just a

829
00:48:06,120 --> 00:48:08,880
good person, you know, just
somebody who's helpful and

830
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:13,000
caring and happy and smiles and
just be a low entropy person.

831
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:16,960
Because just by being that way,
you'll help other people become

832
00:48:16,960 --> 00:48:19,480
that way.
You will be a good example and

833
00:48:19,480 --> 00:48:21,440
you'll just people around you
will make you.

834
00:48:22,400 --> 00:48:24,920
They'll feel better when they're
hanging out with you.

835
00:48:24,920 --> 00:48:27,120
They all kind of feel better
than not.

836
00:48:27,120 --> 00:48:32,040
So you're a you're a force to
help them grow up.

837
00:48:32,480 --> 00:48:36,880
So you come back and be part of
the solution, not part of the

838
00:48:36,880 --> 00:48:40,480
problem.
So there is no end to it.

839
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:46,600
Now, a lot of the religious
theologies always, you know,

840
00:48:46,600 --> 00:48:50,400
they have ends to it because
otherwise it's a hard sell.

841
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:54,320
If you, if you tell people,
well, what's what's the point,

842
00:48:54,320 --> 00:48:56,840
They say and say, well, so you
can be helpful to others, Well,

843
00:48:56,920 --> 00:48:59,480
you know, when do I graduate?
When do I get done?

844
00:48:59,480 --> 00:49:03,840
And if you say never, you're
doing this forever because you

845
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:06,200
know you're you're an
information system and we can

846
00:49:06,200 --> 00:49:09,840
always get better.
If just you and 10 people and

847
00:49:09,840 --> 00:49:11,360
you all care for each other,
that's nice.

848
00:49:11,360 --> 00:49:13,960
But you need to care for
everybody on the planet and all

849
00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:18,520
the dogs and cats too, you know
and everything you need to be

850
00:49:19,120 --> 00:49:22,000
take care of the planet and its
environment.

851
00:49:22,000 --> 00:49:24,280
You know, there's lots of things
that are positive that you need

852
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:28,520
to learn to do, so there's no
end to that.

853
00:49:28,520 --> 00:49:31,040
You can always come back and
teach and be helpful.

854
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:34,280
Well, that's a hard sell.
You know, Why would why would

855
00:49:34,320 --> 00:49:37,160
somebody want to pay their money
into that collection plate?

856
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:39,920
You know, when the other
collection plate says, Oh yeah,

857
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,680
you know, when you die, if you
do everything right and keep

858
00:49:42,680 --> 00:49:45,960
that collection plate full,
you'll go to heaven and that's

859
00:49:45,960 --> 00:49:47,880
it.
You'll just be happy and be

860
00:49:48,200 --> 00:49:50,560
perfectly, you know, content
forever.

861
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:54,040
Well, that's a easier sale.
Oh, that sounds good.

862
00:49:54,040 --> 00:49:57,040
What do I got to donate a lot of
money to the church and I'm in

863
00:49:57,040 --> 00:50:02,560
forever?
Or like in the in Buddhism, you

864
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:07,120
return to the Godhead, OK, you
go up, but you get to the point

865
00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:10,600
that then you just become a part
of God and that's good.

866
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:15,440
But you see that's contrary to
what the larger consciousness

867
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:17,600
did in the 1st place.
It had to break itself up into

868
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:22,480
pieces so that there were these
pieces that you know, interacted

869
00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:25,960
with each other.
The idea everybody lowers their

870
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:28,480
entropy, everybody gets up,
everybody returns to the

871
00:50:28,480 --> 00:50:32,560
godhead, Then what do you have?
You just move backwards, a long

872
00:50:32,560 --> 00:50:36,680
way backwards.
Now you have one, you know, one

873
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:40,600
chunk of consciousness where all
the pieces have returned.

874
00:50:41,120 --> 00:50:44,360
Well, it's very limited.
It'll start to de evolve rather

875
00:50:44,360 --> 00:50:46,760
quickly.
You know, the point is that

876
00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:50,520
you've got billions of pieces
that all have to learn to work

877
00:50:50,520 --> 00:50:53,760
together, cooperative and caring
for everybody.

878
00:50:54,080 --> 00:50:57,160
Well, that's a harder thing to
do, you see.

879
00:50:57,160 --> 00:51:00,320
And one monolithic thing can't
do that.

880
00:51:01,440 --> 00:51:04,520
It can just kind of care for
itself.

881
00:51:05,000 --> 00:51:08,680
But that's kind of self focused,
you know, caring for others, a

882
00:51:08,680 --> 00:51:10,600
tough thing when you're the only
thing around.

883
00:51:11,160 --> 00:51:14,600
So it you end up de evolving.
So that's really headed in the

884
00:51:14,600 --> 00:51:17,440
wrong direction.
So I don't think that the

885
00:51:17,440 --> 00:51:22,680
joining the Godhead is is really
the the point unless the larger

886
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:26,360
system has way too many IUSCS
out there.

887
00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:28,800
And I'd like to you know, I'd
like to cut the number down.

888
00:51:28,800 --> 00:51:32,000
You know the number of seats in
the game has gotten too large.

889
00:51:32,000 --> 00:51:34,360
I'd like to cut some down.
Then some of those might just be

890
00:51:34,360 --> 00:51:38,560
absorbed back into the LCS, yes,
but not in general.

891
00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:40,280
That's not the way that it's
going to be.

892
00:51:40,400 --> 00:51:45,240
That's not the point, is not to
go up and and become part of the

893
00:51:45,240 --> 00:51:50,520
deity.
It's to keep helping others, see

894
00:51:51,120 --> 00:51:53,240
others.
You know, unless you're the last

895
00:51:53,240 --> 00:51:56,240
one everybody else has,
everybody else has succeeded and

896
00:51:56,240 --> 00:51:59,000
you're the last one you know.
But it's not going to be that

897
00:51:59,000 --> 00:52:00,600
way.
There's always new coming in at

898
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:02,920
the bottom.
People are having babies, new

899
00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:08,600
new avatars are all the time.
And you need a, someone needs

900
00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:12,280
to, you know, just to keep this
virtual reality going, you know,

901
00:52:12,280 --> 00:52:15,920
needs to play the part of those
avatars or the system gets stuck

902
00:52:15,920 --> 00:52:20,800
playing all of them, You know,
now they're they're not IUOCS,

903
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:24,640
they're NPCS, non player
characters, because the the the

904
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:27,280
server is playing the parts of
all of those.

905
00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:32,640
Well, now the whole system, this
whole entropy reduction trainer

906
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:36,440
system has become inefficient.
You know, it's starting to, it's

907
00:52:36,440 --> 00:52:38,120
starting to outlive its
usefulness.

908
00:52:38,680 --> 00:52:40,840
So I don't think any of that's
going to happen.

909
00:52:40,840 --> 00:52:44,760
There's always going to be those
who aren't as as far along as

910
00:52:44,760 --> 00:52:47,280
you are.
And if you can help them, then

911
00:52:47,720 --> 00:52:51,200
if you're grown up, what you
want to do is help them.

912
00:52:51,640 --> 00:52:55,520
You don't want to quit and go
play a harp on a cloud for

913
00:52:55,520 --> 00:52:57,360
eternity.
You want to be helpful.

914
00:52:57,360 --> 00:53:00,040
You want to get back in the game
and be part of the solution.

915
00:53:00,600 --> 00:53:04,800
That's what you like doing.
That's what makes you happy.

916
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:07,640
So you're you're, you're
incarnated, let's say, and you

917
00:53:07,640 --> 00:53:09,200
go through this journey to
Logical.

918
00:53:09,760 --> 00:53:13,400
Scenarios can arise.
One is the information is is

919
00:53:14,000 --> 00:53:16,400
neither created nor destroyed in
this in that sense.

920
00:53:16,720 --> 00:53:19,160
But let's say the information
continues.

921
00:53:19,360 --> 00:53:22,240
That means you have access to
information from the previous

922
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:25,360
avatar's existence.
So that opens the door to

923
00:53:26,200 --> 00:53:29,600
talking to a past life or or
seeing a past life at least.

924
00:53:29,920 --> 00:53:34,520
And also the information also
can perhaps intrude into the

925
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:36,640
future, perhaps into a near
death experience.

926
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:38,160
How would those two things
occur?

927
00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:42,320
Well, a near death.
Let's just jump to a near death

928
00:53:42,320 --> 00:53:43,720
and then we'll talk about the
data.

929
00:53:43,720 --> 00:53:46,720
Because now you're touching on
this database that I was talking

930
00:53:46,720 --> 00:53:49,440
about.
And I can explain why there is a

931
00:53:49,440 --> 00:53:53,880
database, why there has to be a
database and how, what that

932
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:57,240
means to be able to access it.
That's where Uncle Fred was.

933
00:53:57,240 --> 00:54:00,280
The guy came to greet you, You
know, he was basically a

934
00:54:00,280 --> 00:54:05,280
projection out of that database.
Because everything we do think

935
00:54:06,080 --> 00:54:08,040
what about doing that didn't
doesn't matter.

936
00:54:08,040 --> 00:54:13,000
Every feeling, all of that is
part of a database and there's a

937
00:54:13,000 --> 00:54:16,440
reason why the system has to
collect that data and I'll get

938
00:54:16,440 --> 00:54:20,320
into that later.
But an NDE is basically somebody

939
00:54:20,320 --> 00:54:25,960
who is, they say a near death
experience, but the body maybe

940
00:54:25,960 --> 00:54:29,440
dies for a little bit and then
gets resuscitated.

941
00:54:30,600 --> 00:54:34,080
So when I say dies, I mean it.
It goes past the point of where

942
00:54:34,080 --> 00:54:38,680
life could be supported at that
state that the physical things

943
00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:41,040
in couldn't support life.
But it doesn't mean that that

944
00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:45,160
state can't be changed to where
it can support life again.

945
00:54:45,160 --> 00:54:49,000
So people get in this spot where
they're dead for a little bit or

946
00:54:49,280 --> 00:54:51,640
if nothing else happened to
bring them back, they would be

947
00:54:51,640 --> 00:54:54,800
dead.
But something else happens and

948
00:54:54,800 --> 00:54:58,160
raises their potential for life
back up positive again.

949
00:54:58,480 --> 00:55:02,760
And now they come back.
So they are out there.

950
00:55:02,760 --> 00:55:05,600
Remember I said when you die,
you kind of come awake and you

951
00:55:05,600 --> 00:55:08,240
say, oh, where am I?
You know, what's going on here?

952
00:55:08,240 --> 00:55:12,600
Well, they end up in that state
in the where am I and what's

953
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:16,120
going on here?
And the way the system works is

954
00:55:16,120 --> 00:55:20,680
they start into the transition.
So they get a something

955
00:55:20,680 --> 00:55:23,560
positive.
Maybe they see a light and you

956
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:27,720
know the reason.
So it's like, well, the light

957
00:55:27,720 --> 00:55:30,080
says so come on, we're come
here.

958
00:55:30,080 --> 00:55:33,040
We've been waiting for you.
You can have a good time here.

959
00:55:33,040 --> 00:55:37,080
You're really going to like it.
You know, it starts positive and

960
00:55:38,160 --> 00:55:42,200
most of the Ndes are positive.
You know, that's typically the

961
00:55:42,200 --> 00:55:44,960
way they are.
They'll see dead relatives,

962
00:55:44,960 --> 00:55:50,120
They'll they'll have a an
experience with the bright light

963
00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:53,200
that is nothing but love, you
know, and they'll get consumed

964
00:55:53,200 --> 00:55:56,640
and connected to this.
Well, all that is is them

965
00:55:57,440 --> 00:56:01,320
experiencing the large of
consciousness system, them

966
00:56:01,320 --> 00:56:07,640
experiencing consciousness at
its best, you know, at a low

967
00:56:07,640 --> 00:56:11,200
entropy consciousness.
And when they do that, of course

968
00:56:11,200 --> 00:56:13,440
that's a life changing
experience.

969
00:56:14,240 --> 00:56:17,880
But when you do that, you lose
all the sense of I, who you are

970
00:56:18,120 --> 00:56:20,120
and you become one with
everything.

971
00:56:20,680 --> 00:56:25,920
And it's such a, it's such AI
don't know what to say, profound

972
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:30,000
experience that it changes
people, they see this light,

973
00:56:30,000 --> 00:56:33,840
they they become part of it and
then they're one with all and

974
00:56:33,840 --> 00:56:36,680
there's nothing but love.
They're just experiencing the

975
00:56:36,680 --> 00:56:40,920
system and how the system sees
things and that's given to them

976
00:56:41,120 --> 00:56:47,400
just to show them kind of the
heart or the core of what

977
00:56:47,400 --> 00:56:50,400
consciousness is all about.
And then they pat them on the

978
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:52,720
butt and send them back into the
game, You know, he says you're

979
00:56:52,720 --> 00:56:54,440
not going to, you know, you're
not going to die.

980
00:56:54,440 --> 00:56:57,680
Go back there and tell people
about this.

981
00:56:58,240 --> 00:57:01,120
So then it helps open other
people's minds.

982
00:57:01,800 --> 00:57:05,640
Other people say, oh wow, you
know, that was that was amazing.

983
00:57:06,040 --> 00:57:09,040
There must be something on that
other side that does that

984
00:57:09,040 --> 00:57:13,200
because there's literally 10s of
thousands of these Ndes and

985
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:15,880
there's a lot of consistency,
you know, in the stories they

986
00:57:15,880 --> 00:57:17,840
tell.
So if they were all just making

987
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:20,440
it up on their own, there
wouldn't be that consistency.

988
00:57:20,800 --> 00:57:26,000
So it kind of lends some
credibility to the fact that

989
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:29,240
there is something else that
this is not just a materialist

990
00:57:29,240 --> 00:57:33,280
reality that's a machine and
everything that happens is, you

991
00:57:33,280 --> 00:57:35,920
know, random basically or
determined.

992
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:41,960
And you know, that's that's kind
of a a deadening concept, not a

993
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:45,160
you know, not an opening up and
enlivening concept.

994
00:57:45,160 --> 00:57:47,920
You know you're nothing, You
don't count for anything.

995
00:57:47,920 --> 00:57:50,800
There is no purpose in your
life, you know, So grab

996
00:57:50,800 --> 00:57:52,760
everything you can grab, have a
good time.

997
00:57:52,760 --> 00:57:56,200
And that's what it's all about.
Well, when you go on that path

998
00:57:56,200 --> 00:57:59,400
where you're grabbing everything
and just having a good time, you

999
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:02,120
end up miserable because you're
not.

1000
00:58:02,480 --> 00:58:06,040
You're being very self-centered.
You're not learning, you're not

1001
00:58:06,040 --> 00:58:12,720
growing, and that life becomes
empty and eventually unpleasant

1002
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:16,480
and you become depressed.
And you know, that's not what

1003
00:58:16,480 --> 00:58:20,520
it's all about.
So materialism kind of pushes

1004
00:58:20,520 --> 00:58:23,920
people in the wrong direction.
You know, greed is a good thing.

1005
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:26,480
I'm grabbing everything I can
grab because it doesn't matter

1006
00:58:26,480 --> 00:58:29,040
anyway, You know, it's survival
of the fittest.

1007
00:58:29,040 --> 00:58:32,400
And I got more money than you.
I must be more fit than you, you

1008
00:58:32,400 --> 00:58:33,880
know.
Well, that's nonsense.

1009
00:58:34,080 --> 00:58:39,040
That's not the way the way it
works at all, but that's kind of

1010
00:58:39,040 --> 00:58:41,200
where a materialist viewpoint
gets you.

1011
00:58:42,680 --> 00:58:47,120
So the system would like to sow
some seed of It's not like that.

1012
00:58:47,360 --> 00:58:50,960
Reality's bigger and more
significant and more important

1013
00:58:50,960 --> 00:58:55,080
and more beautiful than just a
random machine where you can do

1014
00:58:55,080 --> 00:58:57,360
whatever you want because it
doesn't matter anyway because

1015
00:58:57,360 --> 00:59:03,160
there is no purpose, you see, So
it goes out of its way to give

1016
00:59:03,160 --> 00:59:09,400
people positive experiences and
then send them back with a story

1017
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:12,120
to tell.
And it does.

1018
00:59:12,120 --> 00:59:15,800
These people write books and you
know, a lot of people get this

1019
00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:18,320
and they think, well, there must
be something else going on, you

1020
00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:21,320
know, because that guy was dead
for 5 minutes and then they

1021
00:59:21,320 --> 00:59:25,280
resuscitated his body and he has
his big story to tell.

1022
00:59:25,280 --> 00:59:27,680
So he's kind of been there and
seen it and come back to tell us

1023
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:30,720
about it.
So it's it's part of the way

1024
00:59:30,720 --> 00:59:36,920
that the larger conscious system
tries to help us grow and you

1025
00:59:36,920 --> 00:59:40,040
know, become love and understand
there's a bigger picture.

1026
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:41,760
So that's what's going on.
Now.

1027
00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:46,440
Some people who are extremely
fearful, the same ones that

1028
00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:49,200
would take longer, you know,
they may take a while when they

1029
00:59:49,200 --> 00:59:52,280
get to that transition reality
to calm them down because they

1030
00:59:52,520 --> 00:59:57,120
they know bad, bad little girls,
little boys and they're going

1031
00:59:57,120 --> 01:00:00,760
straight to hell and it's going
to be horrible and they believe

1032
01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:02,520
that.
So they come in almost in a

1033
01:00:02,520 --> 01:00:04,760
panic, you know, now they've
died.

1034
01:00:04,760 --> 01:00:07,360
They.
They got run over by a truck,

1035
01:00:07,360 --> 01:00:10,720
didn't even have a priest or
somebody, you know, absolve them

1036
01:00:10,720 --> 01:00:12,480
of all their sins before they
died.

1037
01:00:12,480 --> 01:00:16,360
And and so you have some of
those people have negative

1038
01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:18,680
experiences because that's what
they expect.

1039
01:00:19,200 --> 01:00:22,520
So the experiences they're
having are basically like

1040
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:24,920
dreams.
It's things that they're making

1041
01:00:24,920 --> 01:00:29,080
up that reflect their beliefs.
And it just takes a while for

1042
01:00:29,080 --> 01:00:32,160
them to get out of that and
realize that, no, it's really

1043
01:00:32,160 --> 01:00:35,400
not that way.
That's just you kind of, you

1044
01:00:35,400 --> 01:00:40,960
know, going out and and living
all the things you've been told

1045
01:00:40,960 --> 01:00:44,320
and the beliefs and so on.
So a few people have that, but

1046
01:00:44,360 --> 01:00:48,520
most people don't.
Most people aren't that what

1047
01:00:48,520 --> 01:00:56,840
that invested you know in their
Most people who are religious go

1048
01:00:56,840 --> 01:01:00,240
because it's a social thing.
That's where their friends are.

1049
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:04,120
They meet, they have dinners,
potluck dinners together, they

1050
01:01:04,120 --> 01:01:07,480
go bowling, you know, they go
skating, they do things.

1051
01:01:07,480 --> 01:01:11,000
You know it's a social club and
you know they have to listen to

1052
01:01:11,000 --> 01:01:13,920
the preacher preach, but they
only have pay attention because

1053
01:01:13,920 --> 01:01:15,960
they're thinking about what
they're going to do afterwards

1054
01:01:15,960 --> 01:01:22,880
and and so on.
So most people claim to be a

1055
01:01:22,880 --> 01:01:28,640
member of a religious faith, but
the great majority don't take it

1056
01:01:28,640 --> 01:01:31,240
that seriously.
But some do.

1057
01:01:32,200 --> 01:01:38,000
And the ones that do, if they
haven't been very wonderful

1058
01:01:38,000 --> 01:01:42,160
people, they start to feel very
fearful when they die.

1059
01:01:42,960 --> 01:01:45,120
So that's really what the Ndes
are about.

1060
01:01:45,120 --> 01:01:47,480
It's an experience that people
have and they have different

1061
01:01:47,480 --> 01:01:49,840
experiences because the system
doesn't just give everybody the

1062
01:01:49,840 --> 01:01:51,800
same experience.
It would sound like, oh, I got

1063
01:01:52,040 --> 01:01:54,520
they got that experience because
they read the book of what

1064
01:01:54,520 --> 01:01:56,880
somebody else did.
You know, it's all just copycat.

1065
01:01:57,680 --> 01:01:59,920
It's just, you know, that's a
part of the culture.

1066
01:01:59,920 --> 01:02:01,600
They're making all up the same
things.

1067
01:02:01,600 --> 01:02:04,320
So there's a lot of varied
experiences, individual

1068
01:02:04,320 --> 01:02:06,640
experiences that that people
have.

1069
01:02:07,200 --> 01:02:10,960
But you know, you can have that
experience almost anytime you

1070
01:02:10,960 --> 01:02:13,600
want.
All you have to do is go get a

1071
01:02:13,600 --> 01:02:17,080
good meditation state, get
consciousness and have an

1072
01:02:17,080 --> 01:02:19,720
intention to connect with the
larger system.

1073
01:02:19,720 --> 01:02:22,880
And there it is, You've got it.
You can have that experience.

1074
01:02:22,880 --> 01:02:26,840
You can be absorbed into the
light and be one with everything

1075
01:02:27,480 --> 01:02:30,640
and feel that love and feel your
connection to everything else.

1076
01:02:30,960 --> 01:02:34,760
That's not an experience you
have to die or almost die to

1077
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:36,080
get.
It's available.

1078
01:02:36,360 --> 01:02:40,680
That's what the that's what the
the Buddhists and the Hindus

1079
01:02:40,680 --> 01:02:42,800
talk about.
You know their Nirvana.

1080
01:02:42,800 --> 01:02:47,080
They're going to, you know, they
have this, this profound

1081
01:02:47,080 --> 01:02:49,800
experience of love and
positivity.

1082
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:51,200
That's what they're talking
about.

1083
01:02:51,200 --> 01:02:54,120
So it's it's not, you don't have
to die to do that.

1084
01:02:54,640 --> 01:02:57,760
All you have to do is learn to
learn to let go.

1085
01:02:57,760 --> 01:02:59,480
Yeah, you know, that's their
enlightenment.

1086
01:02:59,960 --> 01:03:02,280
It's not that's not really
enlightenment.

1087
01:03:02,600 --> 01:03:05,880
That just means that they've
learned to control their

1088
01:03:05,880 --> 01:03:10,400
consciousness to the point that
they can let go and become one

1089
01:03:10,400 --> 01:03:14,120
with things.
It's nice, but it's not the end

1090
01:03:14,440 --> 01:03:18,240
of the road.
What's really important is how

1091
01:03:18,680 --> 01:03:21,040
kind and helpful they are.
They are the people.

1092
01:03:21,520 --> 01:03:24,200
You can be very self-centered
and get that experience.

1093
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:28,080
You know, it's not only the
people who are almost near death

1094
01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:30,240
that are that aren't
self-centered.

1095
01:03:30,360 --> 01:03:33,400
You can be very self-centered
and still get to that experience

1096
01:03:33,800 --> 01:03:35,840
and still have a long way to
evolve.

1097
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:39,400
But that's some of the
differences, you know, that's

1098
01:03:39,800 --> 01:03:45,840
religions create dogmas and
beliefs and then they kind of

1099
01:03:45,840 --> 01:03:51,080
work toward those beliefs.
So anyway, I think that answers

1100
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:52,360
your question.
That's ND ES.

1101
01:03:52,360 --> 01:03:54,240
Now what we're going to get to
is the database.

1102
01:03:54,880 --> 01:04:01,040
So the database has to be
created, but it's created first

1103
01:04:01,080 --> 01:04:09,240
as a probable future database.
Everything I say everything not

1104
01:04:09,320 --> 01:04:12,320
not really meaning everything,
but let me just use that word.

1105
01:04:12,400 --> 01:04:19,360
Everything that is possible to
happen and the probability of

1106
01:04:19,360 --> 01:04:23,840
each one of those possibilities.
OK, so there's some event

1107
01:04:23,840 --> 01:04:28,080
that'll happen and maybe that
event will has might go, you

1108
01:04:28,080 --> 01:04:30,160
know, 20 different ways.
So those are all the

1109
01:04:30,160 --> 01:04:32,680
possibilities.
Now each one of those has a

1110
01:04:32,680 --> 01:04:35,480
probability some are more
probable than others.

1111
01:04:36,080 --> 01:04:40,160
You know if they're all equally
probable, then you know that's

1112
01:04:40,240 --> 01:04:43,120
possible too.
But they all have probabilities.

1113
01:04:44,000 --> 01:04:47,040
Now the reason that the system
has to know that about the

1114
01:04:47,040 --> 01:04:52,280
probable future is that that's
how it knows what to render

1115
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:56,520
next.
You see, if this were a bottoms,

1116
01:04:56,920 --> 01:04:59,160
a bottom, I shouldn't say
bottoms, that makes it a

1117
01:04:59,160 --> 01:05:02,880
different thing.
If it's a bottom up, bottoms up

1118
01:05:03,480 --> 01:05:07,160
is either drinking or or giving
mooning somebody, right?

1119
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:11,240
It's one of those two things.
But bottom up means you start at

1120
01:05:11,240 --> 01:05:14,760
the detail level and move back
up toward, you know the more

1121
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:17,960
fundamental level.
So it's it's it's that way.

1122
01:05:18,240 --> 01:05:21,840
So if you do that, then you'd
start with elementary particles

1123
01:05:22,200 --> 01:05:27,760
and you'd take them and make
atoms and then the atoms to make

1124
01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:30,480
molecules and the molecules to
make physical stuff.

1125
01:05:30,840 --> 01:05:36,200
So that would be you have to
calculate that, and physics and

1126
01:05:37,280 --> 01:05:39,920
science in general is
materialistic and therefore

1127
01:05:39,920 --> 01:05:42,400
deterministic.
And they would tell you that if

1128
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:47,120
I had the the state of every
particle in the universe, then I

1129
01:05:47,120 --> 01:05:52,000
can compute everything else
forever, because the physics

1130
01:05:52,000 --> 01:05:54,080
just rules.
It's the rules of how things

1131
01:05:54,080 --> 01:05:55,760
have to change.
So if I knew what everything

1132
01:05:55,760 --> 01:05:58,760
was, I just apply the rules and
I know how everything had to

1133
01:05:58,760 --> 01:06:02,440
change.
And there is no free will, there

1134
01:06:02,440 --> 01:06:06,080
is no consciousness.
Laplace is deep, yeah.

1135
01:06:06,080 --> 01:06:07,720
Actually there is no time, you
know.

1136
01:06:07,760 --> 01:06:11,600
So they have to get rid of all
those things because materialism

1137
01:06:11,600 --> 01:06:14,520
is not logically compatible with
any of those things, you know,

1138
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:17,320
it's only compatible with
determinism.

1139
01:06:18,160 --> 01:06:22,120
So in any case this system isn't
made that way.

1140
01:06:22,440 --> 01:06:26,800
That would be a hugely
inefficient way to run a a model

1141
01:06:26,800 --> 01:06:31,520
of of this reality trying to you
know I mean how many particles

1142
01:06:31,520 --> 01:06:35,600
you know we have we have like
what 3 trillion cells or

1143
01:06:35,600 --> 01:06:39,960
something just in one body and
each one of those cells has has

1144
01:06:39,960 --> 01:06:44,000
probably trillions of trillions
of trillions of atoms and and

1145
01:06:44,720 --> 01:06:48,040
and you know elementary each
each atom has a whole bunch of

1146
01:06:48,040 --> 01:06:51,560
elementary particles and you
know I mean it just gets to be

1147
01:06:51,560 --> 01:06:54,480
impossible to deal with that if
you're trying to build something

1148
01:06:54,480 --> 01:06:56,760
from the ground up that doesn't
work.

1149
01:06:57,080 --> 01:07:01,760
So what works is that you have a
rule set, remember the rule set

1150
01:07:01,760 --> 01:07:04,800
initial conditions and a rule
set is what made the made the

1151
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:06,720
reality.
So you have that rule set, and

1152
01:07:06,720 --> 01:07:09,520
that rule set is mostly
deterministic with some

1153
01:07:09,560 --> 01:07:13,080
probability included in it
because some natural processes

1154
01:07:13,080 --> 01:07:18,000
are are random and you have that
rule set.

1155
01:07:18,000 --> 01:07:23,600
So you can create models of
things, look at their

1156
01:07:23,600 --> 01:07:28,160
probability, and then use that
probability model to actually

1157
01:07:28,160 --> 01:07:32,920
run the simulation.
And the best example I can I can

1158
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,520
give of that is A is a cannon
firing cannonballs.

1159
01:07:35,520 --> 01:07:39,000
And I'll do this real quickly is
that if you had to compute where

1160
01:07:39,000 --> 01:07:42,640
the cannonball landed from the
bottom up, it'd be too hard to

1161
01:07:42,640 --> 01:07:44,480
do.
You'd have to deal with every

1162
01:07:44,960 --> 01:07:48,520
molecule of the cannon, every
molecule of the Wick, every

1163
01:07:48,520 --> 01:07:51,560
molecule of the powder, and you
know all of that.

1164
01:07:51,840 --> 01:07:54,800
And then you'd have to deal with
all the atoms, and then you'd

1165
01:07:54,800 --> 01:07:57,280
have to deal with all the.
You know, it gets crazy.

1166
01:07:57,680 --> 01:07:59,160
And of course everything's
changing.

1167
01:07:59,160 --> 01:08:02,720
The cannonball goes out.
The cannon doesn't have a

1168
01:08:02,720 --> 01:08:05,920
perfect cylinder.
The cannonball isn't perfectly

1169
01:08:05,920 --> 01:08:09,160
round.
The powder doesn't burn, you

1170
01:08:09,160 --> 01:08:12,040
know, evenly.
You got all the stuff, the

1171
01:08:12,040 --> 01:08:15,320
cannon, the cannon material gets
hot because it, you know, the

1172
01:08:16,800 --> 01:08:19,720
creates a lot of heat.
As it gets hot, all those

1173
01:08:19,720 --> 01:08:21,920
molecules start doing different
things.

1174
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:23,680
The barrel starts to sag a
little.

1175
01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:28,000
And yeah, so to keep up with all
of that from the bottom up, we

1176
01:08:28,000 --> 01:08:30,040
couldn't do it.
You could get all the computers,

1177
01:08:30,439 --> 01:08:33,120
all the supercomputers in the
world together and they still

1178
01:08:33,120 --> 01:08:37,359
couldn't run that simulation in
real time for just one simple

1179
01:08:37,359 --> 01:08:39,040
cannon, much less the whole
world.

1180
01:08:39,040 --> 01:08:42,600
You know, it's too hard.
So what you do is you take a

1181
01:08:42,600 --> 01:08:46,399
model of a cannon from the reef,
get the rule set, OK, you get

1182
01:08:46,399 --> 01:08:50,920
your cannon and you let it be
statistically, not, not a

1183
01:08:51,200 --> 01:08:53,880
perfect sphere for the ball.
Statistically, You know, you do

1184
01:08:53,880 --> 01:08:56,880
this all with statistics,
statistically that it's not

1185
01:08:56,880 --> 01:08:59,960
perfectly round statistically,
how the powder burns.

1186
01:09:00,640 --> 01:09:05,080
And you throw all that together
and you say, OK, I fire this

1187
01:09:05,080 --> 01:09:06,680
ball and it's going to land
here.

1188
01:09:06,880 --> 01:09:09,200
Then you fire another one.
All the statistics mean it's

1189
01:09:09,200 --> 01:09:11,560
going to land someplace else.
It's not going to land exactly

1190
01:09:11,560 --> 01:09:13,439
there.
And you do it until you have a

1191
01:09:13,439 --> 01:09:17,200
pattern that's called, you know
that that is ballistic

1192
01:09:17,200 --> 01:09:20,560
dispersion is what we call it
when we fire a cannon 1000

1193
01:09:20,560 --> 01:09:22,800
times.
None of those balls will land on

1194
01:09:22,800 --> 01:09:24,040
top each other.
Exactly.

1195
01:09:24,040 --> 01:09:27,359
They'll all land in a pattern
somewhere around, you know, out

1196
01:09:27,359 --> 01:09:28,560
there where the cannon is
pointed.

1197
01:09:28,960 --> 01:09:33,560
Well, that becomes now a
probability distribution of

1198
01:09:33,560 --> 01:09:37,920
where that cannon will will send
a a ball.

1199
01:09:38,680 --> 01:09:43,120
So now when you're in the a
civil war with, you know, 10,000

1200
01:09:43,120 --> 01:09:46,439
cannons always firing as fast as
they can.

1201
01:09:46,880 --> 01:09:50,640
Every time a cannon fires, you
go up and you do a random draw

1202
01:09:50,640 --> 01:09:53,120
from that probability
distribution and that's where

1203
01:09:53,120 --> 01:09:56,560
you put the ball.
OK, so you you have this

1204
01:09:56,560 --> 01:09:58,240
distribution of the
possibilities.

1205
01:09:58,240 --> 01:10:00,800
Some will be right where it's
pointed, some will be off to the

1206
01:10:00,800 --> 01:10:03,200
left, some off to the right,
some a little closer, some a

1207
01:10:03,200 --> 01:10:05,200
little further away.
All of them.

1208
01:10:05,200 --> 01:10:07,360
You have all these
probabilities.

1209
01:10:07,800 --> 01:10:10,480
If it's off to the right, then
the probability's less that it's

1210
01:10:10,480 --> 01:10:13,120
going to be off to the right.
If it's right down the middle,

1211
01:10:13,120 --> 01:10:15,240
there's a higher probability
that it's going to land there.

1212
01:10:15,240 --> 01:10:17,280
You see what I mean?
So then they go into the

1213
01:10:17,280 --> 01:10:19,320
distribution to a random draw
out of that.

1214
01:10:19,360 --> 01:10:20,960
Nah, this one's off to the
right.

1215
01:10:21,000 --> 01:10:22,480
Nah, the next one's right in the
middle.

1216
01:10:22,480 --> 01:10:24,560
Oh, the next one's off to the
left, and so on.

1217
01:10:24,560 --> 01:10:27,200
They're just random draws from
those possibilities and those

1218
01:10:27,200 --> 01:10:32,200
probabilities.
So then the system then just

1219
01:10:32,400 --> 01:10:38,600
puts those cannonballs there,
and nobody knows.

1220
01:10:38,880 --> 01:10:42,560
The soldiers all running around.
They hear the boom, the ball

1221
01:10:42,560 --> 01:10:45,360
lands someplace and they don't
say, oh, that ball shouldn't

1222
01:10:45,360 --> 01:10:47,480
have landed there, You know,
that's not right.

1223
01:10:48,000 --> 01:10:51,080
It lands where it lands.
The system doesn't have to do it

1224
01:10:51,080 --> 01:10:55,000
to that much accuracy.
In the Civil War, nobody was

1225
01:10:55,000 --> 01:10:58,760
would fault it if, you know, it
landed someplace really

1226
01:10:58,760 --> 01:11:01,800
squirrely.
It just things go boom, things

1227
01:11:01,800 --> 01:11:04,640
land.
So it can do that to what it

1228
01:11:04,640 --> 01:11:07,640
only has to do that maybe to you
know in an integer don't even

1229
01:11:07,640 --> 01:11:09,400
have to do it to 1 decimal
place.

1230
01:11:09,400 --> 01:11:12,640
It is roughly can do it because
nobody's measuring.

1231
01:11:13,680 --> 01:11:16,520
So it makes a really simple
calculation.

1232
01:11:16,520 --> 01:11:19,320
When you don't have to do it to
you know 20 decimal places you

1233
01:11:19,320 --> 01:11:21,960
don't have to do it.
You know you can round it off to

1234
01:11:21,960 --> 01:11:28,880
the nearest meter would be fine.
So that's that's a model.

1235
01:11:29,000 --> 01:11:31,680
And you see how simple that is.
Now you have a you have the

1236
01:11:31,680 --> 01:11:35,080
simulation of this war with the
10,000 cannons.

1237
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:40,200
No, no sweat.
Those little random draws are

1238
01:11:40,480 --> 01:11:43,120
almost instantaneous.
There's no big calculation.

1239
01:11:43,920 --> 01:11:46,320
So you've you've reduced
something that is so hard we

1240
01:11:46,320 --> 01:11:49,040
can't do it to something that's
almost trivial.

1241
01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:56,320
You just pull random things out.
So in a bottom up simulation, if

1242
01:11:56,320 --> 01:11:59,000
there could ever be such a
thing, that bottom up

1243
01:11:59,000 --> 01:12:01,840
simulation, you always know
what's going to happen next

1244
01:12:01,840 --> 01:12:04,800
because it's just what the
machine is going to do next

1245
01:12:04,800 --> 01:12:07,920
given where it is now.
But when it's a probability

1246
01:12:07,920 --> 01:12:11,240
based model, there is no way to
know exactly what's going to

1247
01:12:11,240 --> 01:12:16,560
happen next, right?
So what happens next is a random

1248
01:12:16,560 --> 01:12:18,560
draw from that probability
distribution of the

1249
01:12:18,560 --> 01:12:21,360
possibilities.
That's what happens next.

1250
01:12:22,800 --> 01:12:26,320
You see, that then allows the
model to to move forward.

1251
01:12:26,640 --> 01:12:32,120
Now that has lots of lots of its
own logical possibility.

1252
01:12:32,120 --> 01:12:35,040
So we get a, you know, and
here's one of my my favorite

1253
01:12:35,040 --> 01:12:37,200
metaphors is that you get a
scientist.

1254
01:12:37,280 --> 01:12:40,240
He's looking with a big
telescope that can look further

1255
01:12:40,240 --> 01:12:42,480
than anybody's seen before.
Nobody's ever seen that.

1256
01:12:42,800 --> 01:12:45,200
Whatever's out there.
Well, what?

1257
01:12:45,480 --> 01:12:49,000
What's out there has to be
something like what's we see out

1258
01:12:49,000 --> 01:12:50,960
there, You know?
I mean, it can't be something

1259
01:12:50,960 --> 01:12:53,600
off the wall.
It has to be, you know, dust and

1260
01:12:53,600 --> 01:12:56,360
swirls and Suns and stuff that's
there.

1261
01:12:56,360 --> 01:13:01,600
Because we've already seen some,
but there's maybe 1000 different

1262
01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:04,600
things, maybe 100,000 different
things that could be out there.

1263
01:13:04,920 --> 01:13:09,200
And they all have a probability.
So that guy turns on his

1264
01:13:09,200 --> 01:13:12,120
telescope and he takes a look at
random draws taken from all

1265
01:13:12,120 --> 01:13:14,840
those possibilities in their
probability.

1266
01:13:14,840 --> 01:13:17,760
And that's what he sees.
That defines it.

1267
01:13:17,760 --> 01:13:20,720
In other words, that piece of
space was not defined before.

1268
01:13:21,280 --> 01:13:23,760
There was nothing there, because
it wasn't defined.

1269
01:13:23,760 --> 01:13:27,040
It never been rendered before,
it was a new rendering of

1270
01:13:27,040 --> 01:13:28,720
something that had not been
rendered.

1271
01:13:29,000 --> 01:13:31,080
So how do you know what's there?
You don't.

1272
01:13:31,080 --> 01:13:34,800
So you take a random draw from
all the from the probability

1273
01:13:34,800 --> 01:13:36,680
distribution of the
possibilities.

1274
01:13:37,440 --> 01:13:40,880
Now, it's not just a random draw
from the from the possibilities

1275
01:13:41,680 --> 01:13:43,680
that would get you all kinds of
squirrely stuff, but it's a

1276
01:13:43,680 --> 01:13:46,320
random draw from the probability
distribution of the

1277
01:13:46,320 --> 01:13:49,240
possibilities.
Which means mostly that random

1278
01:13:49,240 --> 01:13:51,040
brawl is going to be more what
you expect.

1279
01:13:51,040 --> 01:13:54,200
The things with higher
probability will get drawn out

1280
01:13:54,200 --> 01:13:56,360
more likely.
But every once in a while you

1281
01:13:56,360 --> 01:13:59,560
pull something out of the tail
of that curve that's only one in

1282
01:13:59,560 --> 01:14:02,880
a million, and bang, that's what
you get, you know?

1283
01:14:03,440 --> 01:14:06,560
So now this guy with his
telescope, he takes his picture

1284
01:14:06,840 --> 01:14:09,800
and he publishes it.
Anybody else who looks there

1285
01:14:09,880 --> 01:14:13,120
will see the same thing, because
once it comes into this reality,

1286
01:14:13,120 --> 01:14:17,040
it stays here.
Now, what if that guy, he took

1287
01:14:17,040 --> 01:14:19,320
the?
Rendering then permanently left

1288
01:14:19,400 --> 01:14:21,960
there?
Or does it kind of just go away

1289
01:14:22,000 --> 01:14:23,360
and then come back sort of when
needed?

1290
01:14:24,480 --> 01:14:27,200
Well, what happens?
Well, no, it's not always

1291
01:14:27,200 --> 01:14:29,160
rendered.
It's only rendered if somebody

1292
01:14:29,160 --> 01:14:31,800
looks.
But if somebody looks, then it's

1293
01:14:31,800 --> 01:14:35,080
rendered to the people looking.
It's not rendered to anybody

1294
01:14:35,080 --> 01:14:38,000
else, you only get rendered to
what you did.

1295
01:14:38,360 --> 01:14:39,800
You mean that the your senses
the?

1296
01:14:40,320 --> 01:14:42,760
Photograph was now the
information that's always going

1297
01:14:42,760 --> 01:14:44,920
to be.
Yeah, that photograph now tells

1298
01:14:44,920 --> 01:14:48,360
you what's going to be there
when you look, when you look,

1299
01:14:48,360 --> 01:14:50,840
that's what will be rendered.
But it's not rendered all the

1300
01:14:50,840 --> 01:14:52,400
time.
It doesn't really exist.

1301
01:14:52,680 --> 01:14:57,320
So there was that was exist
before and now anybody that

1302
01:14:57,320 --> 01:15:00,280
looks there will see that.
So that's the way it works.

1303
01:15:00,280 --> 01:15:02,680
But you know, you don't have to
do something like look into

1304
01:15:02,680 --> 01:15:04,120
outer space.
All you have to do is get a

1305
01:15:04,120 --> 01:15:07,000
shovel and dig a hole.
It's the same thing when you dig

1306
01:15:07,000 --> 01:15:09,600
that hole and you put it up.
Nobody's seen that before.

1307
01:15:09,600 --> 01:15:13,200
It's new stuff to be rendered.
So you go into a probability

1308
01:15:13,200 --> 01:15:15,000
distribution, and that's what we
know.

1309
01:15:15,000 --> 01:15:19,560
What's in that hole?
Dinosaur bone, gold, doubloon.

1310
01:15:20,480 --> 01:15:22,320
Dirt.
You know, rocks.

1311
01:15:22,320 --> 01:15:23,840
Now that's higher probability,
right?

1312
01:15:23,840 --> 01:15:27,080
Dirt, rocks, roots.
That kind of stuff is real

1313
01:15:27,080 --> 01:15:30,160
probable.
And the gold doubloon is not too

1314
01:15:30,160 --> 01:15:33,480
probable unless you live maybe
on the Gulf Coast or someplace.

1315
01:15:33,480 --> 01:15:35,400
What?
About those far less probable

1316
01:15:35,400 --> 01:15:39,040
ones like the near death
experience or even just

1317
01:15:39,040 --> 01:15:42,000
communicating with past lives,
how did those really occur then

1318
01:15:42,000 --> 01:15:45,200
within the OK, well, what?
OK, well, what happens is that

1319
01:15:45,720 --> 01:15:50,240
that database, they collect,
this big database and that

1320
01:15:50,240 --> 01:15:54,080
database is just probabilities.
Now the things don't have to

1321
01:15:54,080 --> 01:15:55,760
happen that way.
We have free will.

1322
01:15:56,000 --> 01:15:58,160
It's just saying present trends
continue.

1323
01:15:58,360 --> 01:16:00,520
Here's what we judge will happen
next.

1324
01:16:00,720 --> 01:16:03,520
And given that that's true,
here's what will happen next

1325
01:16:03,520 --> 01:16:05,720
after that.
And given that that's true,

1326
01:16:05,720 --> 01:16:07,680
here's what?
Well, the further out you go,

1327
01:16:07,680 --> 01:16:10,800
then the rattier it gets, you
know, it gets to where you've

1328
01:16:10,800 --> 01:16:13,440
got this whole string of
assumptions all in a line.

1329
01:16:13,720 --> 01:16:17,400
And when what happens isn't what
was expected, then the system

1330
01:16:17,400 --> 01:16:22,080
has to go back and recalculate
that change, and all the things

1331
01:16:22,080 --> 01:16:25,360
that that change effects gets
recalculated, you know, into the

1332
01:16:25,360 --> 01:16:29,080
probable future again.
But that's not really that hard

1333
01:16:29,200 --> 01:16:35,840
to do.
So time goes by and that you

1334
01:16:35,840 --> 01:16:41,160
know that future probable, or I
should say probable future

1335
01:16:41,320 --> 01:16:45,680
database becomes the past.
We're past that point now, but

1336
01:16:45,680 --> 01:16:47,440
now you end up with this
database.

1337
01:16:47,440 --> 01:16:49,800
That's everything that could
have happened and the

1338
01:16:49,800 --> 01:16:51,640
probability that it would have
happened.

1339
01:16:51,640 --> 01:16:56,280
It's a past probable database.
And what actually did happen is

1340
01:16:56,280 --> 01:16:59,800
just a little thread that kind
of wanders through that bunch of

1341
01:16:59,800 --> 01:17:01,400
probabilities.
Those are the choices you

1342
01:17:01,400 --> 01:17:04,840
actually did make.
Now that database is in

1343
01:17:04,840 --> 01:17:07,240
consciousness.
It has to be made because the

1344
01:17:07,240 --> 01:17:11,800
rendering engine needs it.
It becomes the past.

1345
01:17:11,800 --> 01:17:14,400
And why does it keep the past?
Well, you can learn from the

1346
01:17:14,400 --> 01:17:15,800
past.
The past can be very

1347
01:17:15,800 --> 01:17:18,160
educational.
So it's all there.

1348
01:17:18,160 --> 01:17:22,640
So Uncle Fred, you know, his
lifetime is all there again.

1349
01:17:22,640 --> 01:17:24,560
It's everything about Uncle
Fred.

1350
01:17:25,160 --> 01:17:30,240
And if anybody wants to go talk
to Uncle Fred later on, you, you

1351
01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:32,560
go pay a medium to go dial up
Uncle Fred.

1352
01:17:32,560 --> 01:17:35,720
And you know, she has a
conversation with Uncle Fred.

1353
01:17:35,960 --> 01:17:39,040
Well, she's, she's getting data
out of that database.

1354
01:17:39,320 --> 01:17:41,760
Uncle Fred doesn't exist
anymore.

1355
01:17:42,120 --> 01:17:45,320
Uncle Fred's Free Will Awareness
unit was had the petition taken

1356
01:17:45,320 --> 01:17:49,320
down and was, you know,
reabsorbed into the individuated

1357
01:17:49,320 --> 01:17:51,960
unit of consciousness.
So Uncle Fred's gone.

1358
01:17:52,480 --> 01:17:55,160
Uncle Fred does not live on
forever.

1359
01:17:55,720 --> 01:17:58,440
None of us do, but the
consciousness does.

1360
01:17:58,720 --> 01:18:04,560
That IUOC lives on forever, and
it's got Uncle Fred and and a

1361
01:18:04,560 --> 01:18:07,480
whole bunch of other
incarnations beside Uncle Fred

1362
01:18:07,480 --> 01:18:09,280
that that consciousness has
made.

1363
01:18:09,960 --> 01:18:13,040
So that becomes part of the
larger database.

1364
01:18:13,440 --> 01:18:18,840
So if you would like to go into
a past life or look at things in

1365
01:18:18,840 --> 01:18:22,000
the past, you can go into that
database, but you have to be a

1366
01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:25,280
little careful because it's not
just the database of what did

1367
01:18:25,280 --> 01:18:28,560
happen, it's the database of
everything that could have

1368
01:18:28,560 --> 01:18:33,120
happened and the probability.
So if you just go into it and

1369
01:18:33,120 --> 01:18:35,560
you don't really know what
you're doing, you're allowed to

1370
01:18:35,560 --> 01:18:38,560
wander off that thread, which
was just the things that

1371
01:18:38,560 --> 01:18:41,760
actually did happen, and you
could go into probability.

1372
01:18:41,760 --> 01:18:45,560
So with your intent, your intent
is the query into that database.

1373
01:18:45,880 --> 01:18:49,800
Your intent has to be very
specific, and it has to specify

1374
01:18:49,800 --> 01:18:52,240
that you want to just look at
things that are on that thread,

1375
01:18:52,240 --> 01:18:53,800
of the things that actually did
happen.

1376
01:18:54,840 --> 01:19:00,360
If you're interested in like a
past life and you can look at it

1377
01:19:00,360 --> 01:19:04,840
and you can do what if games,
you could say, well what if this

1378
01:19:04,840 --> 01:19:07,760
didn't happen, how would that
change things?

1379
01:19:07,760 --> 01:19:10,200
Well the whole thing will just
run through the probabilities.

1380
01:19:10,200 --> 01:19:12,760
If that didn't happen then it
would change this probability

1381
01:19:12,760 --> 01:19:15,040
which would change go to that
probability which would go to

1382
01:19:15,040 --> 01:19:18,040
that probability cause all the
probabilities are in there.

1383
01:19:18,200 --> 01:19:20,880
So it just takes a a line
running through all the

1384
01:19:20,880 --> 01:19:24,520
probabilities that would be most
likely to have occurred because

1385
01:19:24,560 --> 01:19:28,360
this thing now didn't happen.
So you could go there and and

1386
01:19:28,360 --> 01:19:33,880
you can say, well, what would
happen if the Axis powers had

1387
01:19:33,880 --> 01:19:37,840
won World War 2?
What would the world be like?

1388
01:19:37,960 --> 01:19:41,200
What would it have been like a
year later, 10 years later, 20

1389
01:19:41,200 --> 01:19:45,480
years later, 50 years later?
And you will get answers to all

1390
01:19:45,480 --> 01:19:47,120
of that.
So you can do those kinds of

1391
01:19:47,120 --> 01:19:49,560
things.
What if I had married Sally

1392
01:19:49,560 --> 01:19:51,920
instead of Sue?
What would my life be like now,

1393
01:19:52,360 --> 01:19:54,960
you know, what would it have
been like a year after I married

1394
01:19:55,200 --> 01:19:56,320
Sally?
Or two years.

1395
01:19:56,320 --> 01:20:00,360
Or 10 years, you know, if I
hadn't forgotten my wife's

1396
01:20:00,360 --> 01:20:02,880
birthday.
Three years in a row, you know

1397
01:20:03,200 --> 01:20:05,520
what?
What would my life be like now?

1398
01:20:05,560 --> 01:20:08,280
You know, well, you wouldn't
have gotten divorced and you

1399
01:20:08,280 --> 01:20:11,880
know, you're, you know, it'll
show you those probabilities.

1400
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:16,520
So you can learn a lot of things
and do a lot of what if analysis

1401
01:20:17,160 --> 01:20:21,120
with those databases, they're
something that's valuable.

1402
01:20:21,480 --> 01:20:24,960
Do you think mediums are
accessing those database or or

1403
01:20:24,960 --> 01:20:27,960
do you feel that for the most
part many of them are not really

1404
01:20:27,960 --> 01:20:29,480
accessing some sort of a
database?

1405
01:20:30,040 --> 01:20:33,440
I find that when a lot of
mediums try to access or talk

1406
01:20:33,440 --> 01:20:35,440
about these things, they're not
very specific with the

1407
01:20:35,440 --> 01:20:37,400
information they provide or
what.

1408
01:20:37,400 --> 01:20:41,000
What do you think about that?
Mediums have no idea how the

1409
01:20:41,000 --> 01:20:44,520
nature of reality works.
All they know is they can.

1410
01:20:44,520 --> 01:20:46,320
They learn.
They don't think they're getting

1411
01:20:46,320 --> 01:20:47,760
a database.
They think they're actually

1412
01:20:47,760 --> 01:20:51,880
talking to a dead Uncle Fred.
Uncle Fred dies, Everybody dies,

1413
01:20:51,880 --> 01:20:54,080
and then they hang out just
waiting for somebody to talk to

1414
01:20:54,080 --> 01:20:56,960
them.
You know, they don't think about

1415
01:20:56,960 --> 01:21:01,040
the, you know, how logical is
that, You know how how rational

1416
01:21:01,040 --> 01:21:05,640
an idea is that they just know
that they can go, they can drop

1417
01:21:05,640 --> 01:21:09,280
into their intuitive side.
They can have an intent for that

1418
01:21:09,280 --> 01:21:11,480
information.
I'd like to talk to Uncle Fred.

1419
01:21:11,760 --> 01:21:17,160
And there comes the information.
There is somebody and they ask

1420
01:21:17,160 --> 01:21:19,680
Uncle Fred a question or
something and Uncle Fred will

1421
01:21:20,160 --> 01:21:20,880
tell them.
So.

1422
01:21:21,240 --> 01:21:23,320
Then it depends on the quality
of the medium.

1423
01:21:23,680 --> 01:21:27,400
If the medium is really very
good, they will get lots of

1424
01:21:27,400 --> 01:21:29,640
detail.
They will.

1425
01:21:29,640 --> 01:21:34,280
They will have that ability to
take to get the detail out of

1426
01:21:34,280 --> 01:21:36,440
the, you know, out of the
database.

1427
01:21:36,880 --> 01:21:39,280
If they're not as good, then
they'll just get generalities.

1428
01:21:39,280 --> 01:21:42,840
They'll get less things.
So that just depends on how good

1429
01:21:42,840 --> 01:21:48,400
the medium is at their task.
Some are better than others, you

1430
01:21:48,400 --> 01:21:50,400
know it.
It just means how much did they

1431
01:21:50,400 --> 01:21:52,400
practice developing their their
trait.

1432
01:21:53,000 --> 01:21:55,800
So I'd say most of them, there's
probably some mediums that are

1433
01:21:55,800 --> 01:21:57,960
just charlatans and they don't
do anything at all, should make

1434
01:21:57,960 --> 01:22:00,920
up stuff.
But I think that's probably a

1435
01:22:00,920 --> 01:22:04,160
very small minority.
I think most of the mediums are

1436
01:22:04,160 --> 01:22:08,240
genuine and I think they've
learned to access this

1437
01:22:08,240 --> 01:22:11,240
information.
But you know, learning to do

1438
01:22:11,240 --> 01:22:16,160
anything, you can learn it a
little bit, you can learn it,

1439
01:22:16,160 --> 01:22:18,920
you know somewhat more.
You can learn it kind of an

1440
01:22:18,920 --> 01:22:22,080
average amount or you can really
excel at it like anything else.

1441
01:22:22,080 --> 01:22:25,880
You know, you become a a
plumber, you can be OK at it,

1442
01:22:26,040 --> 01:22:30,000
you can, you can be really
fantastic at it, you know, I

1443
01:22:30,000 --> 01:22:32,240
mean anything is like that.
Well, it's the same with the

1444
01:22:32,240 --> 01:22:34,680
medium.
Some are are much better than

1445
01:22:34,680 --> 01:22:36,840
others.
It depend how much time they

1446
01:22:36,840 --> 01:22:40,240
take, trying to hone their
skills, how much confidence they

1447
01:22:40,240 --> 01:22:44,400
build up in it, what are they
able to to get.

1448
01:22:44,840 --> 01:22:47,520
So some will get generalities
because that's the level at

1449
01:22:47,520 --> 01:22:50,960
which they work and those
generalities maybe all it's

1450
01:22:50,960 --> 01:22:53,560
necessary.
It could be that their client

1451
01:22:54,080 --> 01:22:58,040
just, you know that person died
and their client who's alive

1452
01:22:58,360 --> 01:23:02,680
never got the closure yet with
that person before they died.

1453
01:23:02,680 --> 01:23:06,440
And so they've been carrying
around this big problem or guilt

1454
01:23:06,440 --> 01:23:09,280
or something because they they
needed to have this, this

1455
01:23:09,280 --> 01:23:11,520
closure first.
And so it helps them.

1456
01:23:12,000 --> 01:23:14,200
So in their case, generalities
are good enough.

1457
01:23:14,360 --> 01:23:17,000
You know you don't need any more
than generalities.

1458
01:23:17,400 --> 01:23:21,640
Those kinds of things work fine.
What the medium gets is they get

1459
01:23:21,640 --> 01:23:28,760
feelings, they get attitudes,
they get some factual details.

1460
01:23:30,440 --> 01:23:34,960
But again, you know, they
they're, they're from OK to to

1461
01:23:34,960 --> 01:23:37,520
terrific, you know, and just
depends on.

1462
01:23:38,080 --> 01:23:41,320
And they're probably some days
they may be better than others

1463
01:23:41,320 --> 01:23:44,640
because they're just more, you
know, if you meditate, if you've

1464
01:23:44,640 --> 01:23:47,840
been meditating for a long time,
you know, some days, oh man,

1465
01:23:47,840 --> 01:23:51,520
it's a sense you can sit down
and that meditation gets deep

1466
01:23:51,520 --> 01:23:54,400
and smooth and you get into it
in a hurry and it's awesome.

1467
01:23:54,680 --> 01:23:58,400
And other times you sit there
and nothing really much happens.

1468
01:23:58,720 --> 01:24:00,120
I mean, everybody's like that,
right?

1469
01:24:00,120 --> 01:24:03,440
I mean, life is like that.
So it's the same with mediums.

1470
01:24:03,440 --> 01:24:06,920
You know, they're not always,
you know, their game is not

1471
01:24:06,920 --> 01:24:13,400
always on, because doing that
work requires that you get into

1472
01:24:13,400 --> 01:24:18,080
a very specific, intuitive state
of mind.

1473
01:24:18,720 --> 01:24:21,440
And if you have problems, you
have issues going on in your

1474
01:24:21,440 --> 01:24:23,000
life.
If you have other things, well,

1475
01:24:23,000 --> 01:24:25,120
they get in the way and kind of
muddy the waters.

1476
01:24:25,320 --> 01:24:27,960
So how good are you at putting
all that stuff aside?

1477
01:24:27,960 --> 01:24:31,600
How good are you at having a
clear, noiseless environment you

1478
01:24:31,600 --> 01:24:35,280
know in your mind to work with?
Well, some days are better than

1479
01:24:35,280 --> 01:24:37,760
others.
Some people are, you know, more

1480
01:24:37,760 --> 01:24:40,080
skilled than others, so it's
just like everything else.

1481
01:24:40,400 --> 01:24:42,840
And you think that crossing?
That crossing over or entering

1482
01:24:42,840 --> 01:24:46,600
that sort of similar transition
state is is purposeful in the

1483
01:24:46,600 --> 01:24:50,240
sense that for the most part
those those access to

1484
01:24:50,240 --> 01:24:53,800
information situations tend to
be very positive for people.

1485
01:24:54,000 --> 01:24:56,560
So you think it's sort of guides
that process you're talking

1486
01:24:56,560 --> 01:24:58,640
about?
Of course they're positive.

1487
01:24:59,040 --> 01:25:02,280
The whole point of it it isn't
because the dead person needs

1488
01:25:02,280 --> 01:25:04,640
something.
Dead person doesn't need

1489
01:25:04,640 --> 01:25:07,440
anything.
They don't need closure or

1490
01:25:07,440 --> 01:25:10,680
anything else.
The the point of it is that

1491
01:25:11,120 --> 01:25:16,040
there's somebody here who's
carrying around grief or guilt

1492
01:25:16,200 --> 01:25:20,320
or some other kind of an issue
that's really keeping them from

1493
01:25:20,320 --> 01:25:23,200
going on and growing and making
good choices.

1494
01:25:23,760 --> 01:25:28,040
They may be waddling around in
self pity because they didn't do

1495
01:25:28,040 --> 01:25:30,360
the things they should have
done, didn't say the things they

1496
01:25:30,360 --> 01:25:33,040
should have said, said things
they shouldn't have said.

1497
01:25:33,040 --> 01:25:35,760
You know, they before that
person died, you know, they

1498
01:25:35,760 --> 01:25:39,480
maybe went off on a rant and
gave them a lot of grief and now

1499
01:25:39,480 --> 01:25:43,280
they they realize most of that
was just them and their own, you

1500
01:25:43,280 --> 01:25:45,920
know, their own frame of mind or
something and they wish they

1501
01:25:45,920 --> 01:25:48,240
hadn't have done that.
So, so they carry this stuff

1502
01:25:48,240 --> 01:25:51,720
around.
So most of the of the the

1503
01:25:51,720 --> 01:25:55,360
clients that come to mediums,
they're the ones that need

1504
01:25:55,360 --> 01:25:58,440
healing.
It's not that Uncle Fred has is

1505
01:25:58,440 --> 01:26:00,600
having problems.
He's not having any problems.

1506
01:26:00,600 --> 01:26:07,720
He's done the the the client has
issues.

1507
01:26:07,840 --> 01:26:12,920
The client needs to know that
Uncle Fred's OK because the

1508
01:26:12,920 --> 01:26:17,320
client has, I don't know they
have ties or they have something

1509
01:26:17,320 --> 01:26:21,000
they they can't let go of.
So they if they just can talk to

1510
01:26:21,000 --> 01:26:24,840
Uncle Fred and he says I'm fine,
you know, everything's great

1511
01:26:24,840 --> 01:26:27,400
here.
And they get convinced that it

1512
01:26:27,400 --> 01:26:30,240
really is Uncle Fred because
they get some personal details

1513
01:26:30,240 --> 01:26:32,360
out of him.
And they say, Oh yeah, if you

1514
01:26:32,360 --> 01:26:34,840
told me that, then I know that
really is, you know, my Uncle

1515
01:26:34,840 --> 01:26:39,200
Fred, then they it heals that
problem for them.

1516
01:26:39,200 --> 01:26:42,960
So that's kind of the the
purpose and point of it is that

1517
01:26:42,960 --> 01:26:45,680
it's healing for the for the
client that wants to do it.

1518
01:26:46,520 --> 01:26:50,120
So that's what's important.
So the messages are almost

1519
01:26:50,120 --> 01:26:53,960
always positive.
Of course, the messages are

1520
01:26:53,960 --> 01:26:58,160
almost always positive.
So there's you know, it's it's

1521
01:26:58,160 --> 01:27:04,280
true that if a person, you know,
if a discussion between the

1522
01:27:04,280 --> 01:27:07,440
client and the dead person was
such that it really would have

1523
01:27:07,440 --> 01:27:09,880
changed the dead person's
viewpoint.

1524
01:27:11,160 --> 01:27:17,000
Well, maybe the change in
thoughts that the alive person

1525
01:27:17,000 --> 01:27:21,840
had and maybe the whole thing
would actually could go back to

1526
01:27:21,840 --> 01:27:26,960
that IUOC as a little bit of new
information about that past life

1527
01:27:26,960 --> 01:27:29,960
that they didn't have before.
So it might actually affect a

1528
01:27:29,960 --> 01:27:32,720
little bit, but you know that's
going to be very, very marginal

1529
01:27:32,720 --> 01:27:35,920
it.
Wouldn't it wouldn't be just a a

1530
01:27:36,360 --> 01:27:39,200
sort of the database that's
stored already.

1531
01:27:39,200 --> 01:27:42,240
It wouldn't you think it
actually would interact with the

1532
01:27:42,880 --> 01:27:47,000
the real data of the individual
that's that existed.

1533
01:27:47,560 --> 01:27:50,600
You think it wouldn't just be
accessing sort of past memories

1534
01:27:50,600 --> 01:27:55,120
or false?
Yeah, false memories.

1535
01:27:55,440 --> 01:27:58,840
Well, probably not if the medium
is good.

1536
01:27:59,600 --> 01:28:03,080
If the medium is not good, then
it's hard to tell what she she

1537
01:28:03,080 --> 01:28:07,760
may be adding stuff to it.
You know, the information a

1538
01:28:07,760 --> 01:28:11,720
person gets comes from only
three possible sources.

1539
01:28:12,160 --> 01:28:15,440
One of them is the larger
conscious system, and the

1540
01:28:15,440 --> 01:28:17,360
database would be just a part of
that.

1541
01:28:17,360 --> 01:28:20,280
So it comes from the system.
It comes from some other

1542
01:28:20,280 --> 01:28:23,400
consciousness, some other IUOC
because we're all netted.

1543
01:28:23,400 --> 01:28:25,760
All consciousness is on a is on
a network.

1544
01:28:26,160 --> 01:28:30,720
So all conscious can talk to any
other consciousness or it comes

1545
01:28:30,720 --> 01:28:34,080
from themselves, their
consciousness, they can create

1546
01:28:34,080 --> 01:28:39,320
information and send it as well.
So in the process of of calling

1547
01:28:39,320 --> 01:28:43,440
up dead Uncle Fred and having a
chat with them, if the medium

1548
01:28:43,960 --> 01:28:48,680
has some kind of issues that
also connect with that problem

1549
01:28:48,680 --> 01:28:52,320
or that thing, let's say she,
you know Uncle Fred jilted Aunt

1550
01:28:52,320 --> 01:28:54,640
Susie.
Now Aunt Susie has come to you

1551
01:28:54,640 --> 01:28:58,400
know talk to Uncle Fred about
stuff that she needs to work out

1552
01:28:58,440 --> 01:29:02,200
and the medium was also jilted
by her husband.

1553
01:29:02,520 --> 01:29:10,720
Now she's got a personal, you
know, thing that this this thing

1554
01:29:10,720 --> 01:29:12,920
that her client is doing, you
know it also is part of her

1555
01:29:12,920 --> 01:29:15,600
personal Well, she may make up
some information there too

1556
01:29:16,040 --> 01:29:19,560
because it's hard to separate
yourself out of it unless you

1557
01:29:19,720 --> 01:29:21,960
are very skilled.
Well, that's part of the skill

1558
01:29:21,960 --> 01:29:27,360
level is how completely you can
isolate yourself, your own ego,

1559
01:29:27,360 --> 01:29:29,440
your own fears from what you're
doing.

1560
01:29:30,080 --> 01:29:32,800
If you can isolate them
completely, then you're a much

1561
01:29:32,800 --> 01:29:35,320
better medium.
If you can isolate them pretty

1562
01:29:35,320 --> 01:29:38,960
good, but not completely, then
you're not quite as good, and so

1563
01:29:38,960 --> 01:29:40,200
on.
So that's just part of the

1564
01:29:40,440 --> 01:29:43,920
talent of the person is how much
they can isolate themselves.

1565
01:29:43,960 --> 01:29:48,080
Otherwise, they may be sticking,
you know, words into Uncle

1566
01:29:48,080 --> 01:29:52,000
Fred's mouth because that's what
they believe, You know, Uncle

1567
01:29:52,000 --> 01:29:55,800
Fred would think or feel.
With, with, with along those

1568
01:29:55,800 --> 01:29:59,400
lines of accessing information
that's not part of everybody's

1569
01:29:59,400 --> 01:30:02,320
day-to-day.
Oh, how how does the Theory of

1570
01:30:02,320 --> 01:30:05,640
everything explain accessing
information beyond your your own

1571
01:30:05,680 --> 01:30:06,440
avatar?
So.

1572
01:30:06,800 --> 01:30:11,640
Sort of telepathic experiences.
Well, you have your piece of

1573
01:30:11,640 --> 01:30:14,000
consciousness.
You're not a body as a piece of

1574
01:30:14,000 --> 01:30:16,200
consciousness.
You can access that database.

1575
01:30:16,280 --> 01:30:19,640
It's available to you.
The way you access it is with an

1576
01:30:19,640 --> 01:30:21,160
intent.
Ask a question.

1577
01:30:21,160 --> 01:30:24,480
You know, send out an intention.
The intention doesn't even have

1578
01:30:24,480 --> 01:30:27,640
to be on purpose.
You may just be thinking about

1579
01:30:27,640 --> 01:30:30,400
something and that might trigger
a response.

1580
01:30:31,680 --> 01:30:34,000
Oh, I wonder how such and such
doing.

1581
01:30:34,000 --> 01:30:37,880
You know, you may just not be in
your conscious mind, but it's in

1582
01:30:37,880 --> 01:30:40,600
your subconscious mind.
And a response comes.

1583
01:30:41,000 --> 01:30:45,280
So we call this intuition.
Oh, I just got a bolt out of the

1584
01:30:45,280 --> 01:30:47,120
blue.
I just suddenly understood

1585
01:30:47,120 --> 01:30:48,960
something.
You know, we I got an

1586
01:30:48,960 --> 01:30:51,440
information, you know answers.
He's having a hard time.

1587
01:30:51,440 --> 01:30:54,720
We ought to call her and see
what's going on there, you know.

1588
01:30:54,720 --> 01:30:57,320
So you get these things, these
messages, conscious to

1589
01:30:57,320 --> 01:31:00,880
consciousness from the from the
database, from the larger

1590
01:31:00,880 --> 01:31:03,160
conscious system, and they're
available to you.

1591
01:31:03,160 --> 01:31:06,560
So if you want to look at
somebody's health where you can

1592
01:31:06,560 --> 01:31:10,960
get that right out of the
database, that database is only,

1593
01:31:11,400 --> 01:31:16,000
you know, we call it historical,
but it starts just 1D T after

1594
01:31:16,000 --> 01:31:19,000
the present moment, so it's
pretty current.

1595
01:31:19,000 --> 01:31:21,520
That delta T is 10 to the -44
seconds.

1596
01:31:21,920 --> 01:31:25,800
So the newest stuff in that
database is only 10 to the -44

1597
01:31:25,800 --> 01:31:29,320
seconds old.
So it's pretty much current, you

1598
01:31:29,320 --> 01:31:33,200
know, from our viewpoint that's
that's current even though it's

1599
01:31:33,200 --> 01:31:37,040
really in the past database.
So then you can look at that

1600
01:31:37,040 --> 01:31:40,840
data and you can say, all right,
what I'd like to see is whether

1601
01:31:40,840 --> 01:31:45,000
or not you know this, this lump
I feel over here, I want to see

1602
01:31:45,000 --> 01:31:48,320
how, how serious that is.
If it's, if it's really serious

1603
01:31:48,320 --> 01:31:51,360
like cancer and deadly, then I
want it to be black.

1604
01:31:51,360 --> 01:31:54,080
If it's not, I want it to be
white.

1605
01:31:55,040 --> 01:31:57,960
So then you look at it, if you
see a black spot, then that's

1606
01:31:57,960 --> 01:32:01,480
your answer.
Now, if you had fear and and

1607
01:32:01,480 --> 01:32:03,680
were afraid you'd get a black
spot, then you may just be

1608
01:32:03,680 --> 01:32:06,920
listening to your own fear.
You see, it may have been you

1609
01:32:06,960 --> 01:32:08,960
feeding that information to
yourself.

1610
01:32:09,760 --> 01:32:11,360
So you have to get rid of all of
that.

1611
01:32:11,360 --> 01:32:15,560
That's what I mean to to do this
well, you need to be able to to

1612
01:32:16,120 --> 01:32:20,160
control what you're thinking and
how you're thinking and where it

1613
01:32:20,160 --> 01:32:23,000
comes from, you know.
And that's a skill that people

1614
01:32:23,400 --> 01:32:26,680
gain over years and years and
years of practice.

1615
01:32:27,320 --> 01:32:30,080
They get better and better at
that.

1616
01:32:30,640 --> 01:32:34,040
So yes, that database is there.
You can look at your health, you

1617
01:32:34,040 --> 01:32:39,720
can look at somebody else's
health and and you also can come

1618
01:32:39,720 --> 01:32:42,920
up with your own output.
So this database is something

1619
01:32:42,920 --> 01:32:46,120
you can ask a question and you
can tell the database how you

1620
01:32:46,120 --> 01:32:48,480
want the data.
You know what the output data

1621
01:32:48,480 --> 01:32:50,400
looks like?
Like the black and white that I

1622
01:32:50,400 --> 01:32:52,840
just described to you.
You know, you don't have to use

1623
01:32:52,840 --> 01:32:54,560
black and white.
You could do just the opposite.

1624
01:32:54,560 --> 01:32:56,960
I want black to be the good
thing, and I want white to be

1625
01:32:56,960 --> 01:33:00,720
the bad thing.
So it's it's irrelevant.

1626
01:33:00,720 --> 01:33:06,080
You can specify the database.
If you're a statistician, you

1627
01:33:06,080 --> 01:33:09,440
can put error bars on it.
You can do all kinds of clever

1628
01:33:09,440 --> 01:33:10,600
things.
If you want to know well what's

1629
01:33:10,600 --> 01:33:13,400
the accuracy of this
information, you know because

1630
01:33:13,400 --> 01:33:18,200
there may be some you know maybe
some of the information isn't

1631
01:33:19,360 --> 01:33:22,360
it's specific if it's really old
it may not be that specific.

1632
01:33:23,320 --> 01:33:26,360
You know just like I said that
it takes you know all the

1633
01:33:26,360 --> 01:33:28,680
possibilities everything that
could happen, well not

1634
01:33:28,680 --> 01:33:31,440
everything it's got some point
you know if the probabilities

1635
01:33:31,720 --> 01:33:35,440
less than 10 to the -20 or
something, we're not interested

1636
01:33:35,440 --> 01:33:37,440
we're not going to count that as
a possibility.

1637
01:33:37,760 --> 01:33:41,160
You know it's got some cut offs
that it that it has to have same

1638
01:33:41,160 --> 01:33:43,040
with the maintaining the
database.

1639
01:33:43,640 --> 01:33:46,520
If you go back and say well OK I
had a great great, great, great,

1640
01:33:46,520 --> 01:33:51,640
great great back and you know
10,000 years ago relative and I

1641
01:33:51,640 --> 01:33:54,240
want to know what did they have
for lunch that day.

1642
01:33:55,280 --> 01:33:58,280
You know what did they had to
lunch exactly 10,000 years ago

1643
01:33:58,280 --> 01:34:00,520
from today from right now at
noon time.

1644
01:34:00,520 --> 01:34:03,800
You know what was my relative
having for lunch that day.

1645
01:34:04,000 --> 01:34:06,280
Well that's not going to be in
the database because that's not

1646
01:34:06,280 --> 01:34:09,320
important anymore.
That's all been erased.

1647
01:34:09,760 --> 01:34:13,920
What hasn't been erased is that
the system, we'll make a a

1648
01:34:13,920 --> 01:34:18,760
statistical model out of it
about what what those times were

1649
01:34:18,760 --> 01:34:22,000
like and about what people might
have eaten in those times.

1650
01:34:22,000 --> 01:34:24,440
You know, that's still there.
You know, there's some general

1651
01:34:24,440 --> 01:34:27,840
thing of it, and it'll just go
in there and pull out something

1652
01:34:28,080 --> 01:34:31,440
typical.
Oh, he had a clam sandwich, you

1653
01:34:31,440 --> 01:34:34,280
know, because he lived on the
Bay of such and such.

1654
01:34:34,760 --> 01:34:39,200
So it just picks that stuff out.
That may not have anything to do

1655
01:34:39,200 --> 01:34:42,280
with what you're, you know, with
the question you asked, but it

1656
01:34:42,280 --> 01:34:48,000
gives you an answer that is
close, sort of like what your

1657
01:34:48,560 --> 01:34:51,800
relative 10,000 years ago might
have had for lunch.

1658
01:34:52,480 --> 01:34:56,000
So it it does things like that.
It gives you the closest answer

1659
01:34:56,000 --> 01:34:57,840
it gets.
So they're not always right on.

1660
01:34:57,840 --> 01:35:00,760
So you can ask it for error bars
and they can say, well, you

1661
01:35:00,760 --> 01:35:04,400
know, could have been different,
could have been this, could have

1662
01:35:04,400 --> 01:35:10,520
been that, you can.
What about telecommunication?

1663
01:35:10,760 --> 01:35:14,520
Is that something you explained
That's that's where all

1664
01:35:14,520 --> 01:35:18,280
consciousness is netted.
So you can you're you are

1665
01:35:18,280 --> 01:35:22,840
connected to people and on this
net, it's sort of like the

1666
01:35:22,840 --> 01:35:25,520
Internet.
You know on the Internet there's

1667
01:35:25,520 --> 01:35:29,200
a little X up at the upper right
hand corner and when you don't

1668
01:35:29,200 --> 01:35:32,080
want to be open to that Channel,
you just click that X and the

1669
01:35:32,080 --> 01:35:34,720
channel's gone.
Or you can do the same here.

1670
01:35:34,720 --> 01:35:38,120
You can open and close channels,
the people that you're close to

1671
01:35:38,120 --> 01:35:40,480
and that you like and that you
have a lot of feelings for and

1672
01:35:40,480 --> 01:35:42,480
you're connected to those
people.

1673
01:35:42,480 --> 01:35:44,000
The channels are almost always
open.

1674
01:35:44,360 --> 01:35:47,800
So you kind of have a sense of
what their state is, where how

1675
01:35:47,800 --> 01:35:51,680
they are, what they're doing.
You can go in and feel their

1676
01:35:51,680 --> 01:35:55,000
feelings and you can you know,
that's called an empath.

1677
01:35:55,000 --> 01:35:58,280
You can be empathetic with them
and gather all that information.

1678
01:35:58,280 --> 01:36:03,160
Well, that just means you're
you're the channel's open and

1679
01:36:03,160 --> 01:36:05,800
you're paying attention to
what's in the channel, what you

1680
01:36:05,800 --> 01:36:09,240
can access in the channel.
But you can also turn things

1681
01:36:09,240 --> 01:36:12,600
off.
You can open the channel and

1682
01:36:12,640 --> 01:36:15,840
turn it off any way you want.
For instance, this would be an

1683
01:36:15,840 --> 01:36:19,440
example if you're a person, if
you're an empath, you get all

1684
01:36:19,440 --> 01:36:22,560
this information and often
empath get overwhelmed by it.

1685
01:36:22,560 --> 01:36:26,360
They can't, they can't deal with
all the information they get and

1686
01:36:26,360 --> 01:36:28,280
they don't know how to turn it
off because they don't

1687
01:36:28,280 --> 01:36:31,280
understand the nature of reality
either, just like the medium

1688
01:36:31,280 --> 01:36:34,120
stuff.
So they can't walk into, let's

1689
01:36:34,120 --> 01:36:39,120
say a busy store, you know, get
some discount house and you

1690
01:36:39,120 --> 01:36:43,480
know, on Evil Friday or whatever
it is, you know, there's there's

1691
01:36:43,480 --> 01:36:46,600
1000 people in there and they're
all trying to grab things first.

1692
01:36:47,040 --> 01:36:51,120
Well, an empath couldn't,
couldn't it even close to that

1693
01:36:51,120 --> 01:36:53,880
store?
Because all the all the vibes

1694
01:36:53,880 --> 01:36:55,680
they'd get would just be too
much.

1695
01:36:55,760 --> 01:37:00,840
They'd have to stay away.
But they could say with their

1696
01:37:00,840 --> 01:37:04,680
intent, well, I want to close
off everything.

1697
01:37:04,680 --> 01:37:08,640
I want to close off everything
coming out of that store, except

1698
01:37:08,640 --> 01:37:14,320
for people that have blue eyes.
If they have blue eyes, I want

1699
01:37:14,320 --> 01:37:16,680
to listen to it.
And then they'd only hear the

1700
01:37:16,680 --> 01:37:18,240
stuff with people with blue
eyes.

1701
01:37:19,480 --> 01:37:22,240
Or I only want to hear from
people who have a birthday

1702
01:37:22,240 --> 01:37:24,640
today.
Well, they'd only hear the stuff

1703
01:37:24,640 --> 01:37:26,240
from people with a birthday
today.

1704
01:37:26,680 --> 01:37:28,680
They can select it.
They just don't know that they

1705
01:37:28,680 --> 01:37:32,240
can do that because they don't
understand how that works.

1706
01:37:32,240 --> 01:37:33,480
What do you call these
phenomenon?

1707
01:37:33,640 --> 01:37:35,120
Do you personally, Do you call
them ESP?

1708
01:37:35,280 --> 01:37:37,560
Do you do you prefer using terms
like that or?

1709
01:37:38,320 --> 01:37:43,400
Well, I would just say that they
are things that are in the

1710
01:37:43,400 --> 01:37:47,720
intuitive realm.
The consciousness has two paths,

1711
01:37:47,880 --> 01:37:51,600
two different paths by which it
can process information.

1712
01:37:51,880 --> 01:37:55,560
One is the intellectual path,
which is basically a logical

1713
01:37:55,560 --> 01:37:59,400
path, and the other one is an
intuitive path which is not

1714
01:37:59,400 --> 01:38:02,760
logical at all.
It's totally outside of logic.

1715
01:38:03,400 --> 01:38:07,320
On the everything paranormal
takes place in the intuitive

1716
01:38:07,320 --> 01:38:09,800
path.
There is nothing paranormal that

1717
01:38:09,800 --> 01:38:12,200
takes place on the on the
intellectual path.

1718
01:38:12,640 --> 01:38:15,480
Matter of fact, the two of
those, they can learn to work

1719
01:38:15,480 --> 01:38:21,040
together, but mostly when you're
not, when you don't have them

1720
01:38:21,040 --> 01:38:24,000
develop very well, they tend to
interfere with each other.

1721
01:38:25,080 --> 01:38:29,760
So what do you define if you
paranormal?

1722
01:38:29,760 --> 01:38:31,720
I think it's very simple.
It's beyond normal.

1723
01:38:32,720 --> 01:38:36,080
It's outside of normal.
Now here's all the things and

1724
01:38:36,080 --> 01:38:40,080
normal in our culture is
materialism.

1725
01:38:40,120 --> 01:38:43,920
What materialism and determinism
comes you know, our physics, our

1726
01:38:43,920 --> 01:38:47,400
science, our biology, our
chemistry, all of that is, is

1727
01:38:47,400 --> 01:38:49,080
the is the rules of the rule
set.

1728
01:38:49,400 --> 01:38:52,360
So we'd look at that and that
defines normal.

1729
01:38:53,440 --> 01:38:55,320
OK, you can explain it with
physics.

1730
01:38:56,600 --> 01:38:59,880
Now the things you can't explain
with physics, and there's lots

1731
01:38:59,880 --> 01:39:01,560
of things you can't explain with
physics.

1732
01:39:02,280 --> 01:39:06,240
Every physics is only good and
biology and chemistry for

1733
01:39:06,240 --> 01:39:10,640
explaining the objective world
in the subjective world.

1734
01:39:10,640 --> 01:39:13,600
I think we said that last time,
the subjective world is a much

1735
01:39:13,600 --> 01:39:17,200
bigger, more interesting, more
meaningful world than the

1736
01:39:17,200 --> 01:39:20,080
objective world.
The objective world is just the

1737
01:39:20,080 --> 01:39:22,440
stuff, your body being part of
that.

1738
01:39:22,440 --> 01:39:25,560
It's just the stuff.
But the subjective world is

1739
01:39:25,920 --> 01:39:34,720
beauty, love, justice, caring,
you know, friendship, fairness,

1740
01:39:35,040 --> 01:39:36,840
you know all that stuff is
subjective.

1741
01:39:37,280 --> 01:39:40,160
It's not objective.
And that's where most of our our

1742
01:39:40,160 --> 01:39:43,000
life's meaning comes from, the
subjective side.

1743
01:39:43,440 --> 01:39:47,240
So the paranormal is stuff that
happens on the subjective side,

1744
01:39:47,600 --> 01:39:50,960
not on the objective side.
So paranormal means it cannot be

1745
01:39:50,960 --> 01:39:54,480
explained by normal objective
means.

1746
01:39:55,520 --> 01:39:57,680
So that's just the definition of
all of it.

1747
01:39:58,440 --> 01:40:02,920
So there will be no normal
explanation because it's it's

1748
01:40:03,040 --> 01:40:06,720
comes out of consciousness, it's
not coming out of the rule set

1749
01:40:06,720 --> 01:40:09,240
in the virtual reality.
This is coming.

1750
01:40:09,480 --> 01:40:13,840
This is things of consciousness.
So consciousness has this big

1751
01:40:13,840 --> 01:40:16,360
database and you can get
information from it.

1752
01:40:16,680 --> 01:40:19,840
All consciousness are netted and
you can share information.

1753
01:40:20,280 --> 01:40:22,600
You know all that stuff happens
in consciousness.

1754
01:40:23,040 --> 01:40:25,600
It doesn't happen in the
objective world.

1755
01:40:25,960 --> 01:40:30,720
You can have a an intent that
modifies those probabilities.

1756
01:40:31,200 --> 01:40:33,080
You can actually modify those
probabilities.

1757
01:40:33,080 --> 01:40:36,520
So when that random draw comes
up, you've made all those

1758
01:40:36,520 --> 01:40:39,560
probabilities a little more
positive toward, you know, a

1759
01:40:39,560 --> 01:40:42,360
little higher probability to the
way you'd like it to come out.

1760
01:40:42,680 --> 01:40:46,040
That's how we use our minds to
heal, by modifying the future

1761
01:40:46,040 --> 01:40:48,360
probability.
So all of these things are

1762
01:40:48,360 --> 01:40:53,720
paranormal in that they have no
objective explanation.

1763
01:40:54,640 --> 01:41:00,360
But all right, neither does
fairness or love have any

1764
01:41:00,360 --> 01:41:05,480
objective explanation, nor
consideration, nor any of the

1765
01:41:05,480 --> 01:41:08,280
other things that are, you know,
important to us in life.

1766
01:41:09,080 --> 01:41:11,400
They don't have any objective
either.

1767
01:41:11,400 --> 01:41:13,720
I mean, how do you measure
consideration?

1768
01:41:15,080 --> 01:41:17,280
You know, how do you, you know?
How do you do that?

1769
01:41:17,320 --> 01:41:19,480
Well, you can't.
You can make a scale.

1770
01:41:19,800 --> 01:41:22,680
But 10 people could make it all
different ways.

1771
01:41:22,680 --> 01:41:25,160
And, you know, one and one
wouldn't be more right than the

1772
01:41:25,200 --> 01:41:29,520
other, you know, So these things
are just subjective.

1773
01:41:30,400 --> 01:41:33,520
And look at medicine.
All of medicine is subjective.

1774
01:41:34,160 --> 01:41:37,000
You know, when somebody says
I've got a pain, well, how much

1775
01:41:37,000 --> 01:41:41,120
of a pain do they really have?
You know, some people have pains

1776
01:41:41,120 --> 01:41:43,640
and hardly notice them because
they're tough that way.

1777
01:41:44,400 --> 01:41:48,800
People who have constant pains
learn to just ignore them, you

1778
01:41:48,800 --> 01:41:52,520
know, and other people who have
just the tiniest little

1779
01:41:52,520 --> 01:41:54,800
something or other, it's it's a
big deal.

1780
01:41:54,800 --> 01:41:56,640
It drives them crazy.
It's horrible.

1781
01:41:57,000 --> 01:42:00,600
So it's all subjective.
So you, you deal with medicine

1782
01:42:01,440 --> 01:42:06,440
and everything is statistical.
They have to give this pill to

1783
01:42:06,760 --> 01:42:09,800
100,000 people and see what the
results are.

1784
01:42:10,520 --> 01:42:12,400
That's how they figure out
whether that pill is any good or

1785
01:42:12,400 --> 01:42:13,640
not.
Not because there's some

1786
01:42:13,640 --> 01:42:15,880
objective analysis that they can
do.

1787
01:42:16,280 --> 01:42:19,960
It's all subjective analysis,
and subjective analysis is only

1788
01:42:19,960 --> 01:42:24,560
meaningful if you do enough of
it that you got statistical

1789
01:42:24,720 --> 01:42:26,440
significance.
You have to.

1790
01:42:26,720 --> 01:42:29,920
Do a sort of clinical control
trial and then get all together

1791
01:42:31,400 --> 01:42:34,240
exactly.
So everything that happens on

1792
01:42:34,240 --> 01:42:41,760
the subjective side is really
not necessarily you can't, you

1793
01:42:41,760 --> 01:42:47,240
can't explain it from the the
objective side doesn't explain

1794
01:42:47,240 --> 01:42:49,760
the subjective side.
That's what paranormal is.

1795
01:42:49,760 --> 01:42:51,440
It's just stuff we don't
understand.

1796
01:42:51,880 --> 01:42:55,280
And when I say don't understand,
that means that the objective

1797
01:42:55,280 --> 01:42:59,040
science can't explain it.
Objective science will never

1798
01:42:59,040 --> 01:43:00,440
explain.
It's not objective, it's

1799
01:43:00,440 --> 01:43:02,640
consciousness.
Consciousness is non physical,

1800
01:43:02,640 --> 01:43:05,640
so you can't have a physical
explanation of something that's

1801
01:43:05,640 --> 01:43:09,440
non physical.
You say this isn't doesn't work

1802
01:43:09,440 --> 01:43:10,880
that way.
It can't be done.

1803
01:43:11,440 --> 01:43:18,960
So you have this, this one side
of you that that is all about

1804
01:43:18,960 --> 01:43:23,200
the subjective and this is the
side that has to get data from

1805
01:43:23,200 --> 01:43:25,280
that database.
This is the side that has to be

1806
01:43:25,280 --> 01:43:30,720
trained to be able to have a low
noise environment to get rid of

1807
01:43:30,840 --> 01:43:34,880
your own attitudes and and
things like that and set them

1808
01:43:34,880 --> 01:43:40,240
aside so you can be entirely
detached from the data that

1809
01:43:40,240 --> 01:43:42,400
you're getting.
You don't mix it with any of

1810
01:43:42,400 --> 01:43:44,880
your own feelings or attitudes
or beliefs.

1811
01:43:45,320 --> 01:43:48,800
So that's the skills that you
have to develop on this

1812
01:43:48,800 --> 01:43:52,600
intuitive side.
Well, most of us have a pretty

1813
01:43:52,600 --> 01:43:57,600
well developed intellectual side
because we practice at it.

1814
01:43:57,600 --> 01:44:00,360
We start in kindergarten, we
Start learning facts, you know,

1815
01:44:00,680 --> 01:44:04,840
and we we get smart about how to
hone our intellect and we don't

1816
01:44:04,840 --> 01:44:06,880
do anything with our intuitive
side.

1817
01:44:06,880 --> 01:44:09,600
Most people were more intuitive
when they were three years old

1818
01:44:09,600 --> 01:44:14,240
than they are now as adults.
So you know, their development

1819
01:44:14,240 --> 01:44:17,840
is like a you know, it's
probably not even as good as a

1820
01:44:17,840 --> 01:44:22,600
newborn.
It's like sub birth almost.

1821
01:44:23,080 --> 01:44:27,720
People just live out of their
heads and and ignore that other

1822
01:44:27,720 --> 01:44:29,720
side of them.
Now that other side's still

1823
01:44:29,720 --> 01:44:32,680
there, things will jump into
their mind.

1824
01:44:32,680 --> 01:44:35,720
They'll get aha moments and
stuff's there, but it's totally

1825
01:44:35,720 --> 01:44:38,080
disorganized.
It just happens whenever it

1826
01:44:38,080 --> 01:44:39,960
happens and they have no control
over it.

1827
01:44:40,400 --> 01:44:44,120
And sometimes it's right,
sometimes it's wrong, you know,

1828
01:44:44,120 --> 01:44:47,920
Sometimes it's their own stuff
getting in the way, their own

1829
01:44:47,920 --> 01:44:49,640
fears just being fed back to
them.

1830
01:44:50,240 --> 01:44:52,080
So they they don't have any
control over it.

1831
01:44:52,080 --> 01:44:54,760
So it's a mess.
It's just this big jumble of

1832
01:44:54,760 --> 01:44:57,560
stuff that is hard to sort
through.

1833
01:44:58,040 --> 01:45:02,320
So we kind of walk away from it.
Well, it doesn't have to be that

1834
01:45:02,320 --> 01:45:05,040
way.
You can develop the intuitive

1835
01:45:05,040 --> 01:45:10,240
side to where it is actually
more accurate and more reliable

1836
01:45:10,440 --> 01:45:13,640
than is the intellectual
information.

1837
01:45:15,360 --> 01:45:18,960
Top The word paranormal term is
often associated.

1838
01:45:19,520 --> 01:45:22,680
Either with what you're talking
about, I mean that love people

1839
01:45:22,680 --> 01:45:24,880
crossing over, having these
great experiences, but then you

1840
01:45:24,880 --> 01:45:27,440
have the other side where you've
got movies like Paranormal

1841
01:45:27,440 --> 01:45:29,680
Activity, lots of horror
stories.

1842
01:45:30,200 --> 01:45:31,760
What do you think is happening
there?

1843
01:45:32,680 --> 01:45:35,160
Part of that is just imagine if
that's not really stuff that

1844
01:45:35,160 --> 01:45:38,720
happens.
I mean, there is some goofy

1845
01:45:38,720 --> 01:45:42,800
things that happen.
And yes, you have this ability

1846
01:45:42,800 --> 01:45:46,880
to modify future probability.
And if you really get everything

1847
01:45:46,880 --> 01:45:49,720
lined up just right and you're
very powerful because you've got

1848
01:45:49,720 --> 01:45:52,520
control over your mind or you
just have to have or maybe you

1849
01:45:52,520 --> 01:45:57,600
have just very strong intensity
in the way you feel and your

1850
01:45:57,600 --> 01:46:01,840
mind just kind of slips through
these states, kind of just

1851
01:46:01,840 --> 01:46:04,720
because your mind is in
different states all the time.

1852
01:46:04,720 --> 01:46:07,160
You know, you're if you take a
look at brain waves, they're

1853
01:46:07,400 --> 01:46:08,920
changing.
They're all over the place

1854
01:46:09,520 --> 01:46:11,560
unless you really know how to
control them.

1855
01:46:11,560 --> 01:46:14,680
And then a person can put them
all here or put them all there.

1856
01:46:15,280 --> 01:46:20,080
But if you get that, then you
can get some some pretty major

1857
01:46:20,080 --> 01:46:24,840
phenomena you can get.
You know, there's all sorts of

1858
01:46:24,840 --> 01:46:31,200
records where where people have
created manifestations of

1859
01:46:31,200 --> 01:46:35,120
things, but they can't do it
because they want to.

1860
01:46:35,760 --> 01:46:38,600
They just happened to cross into
the right state at the right

1861
01:46:38,600 --> 01:46:41,480
moment when they were full of
some kind of intensity in a, you

1862
01:46:41,480 --> 01:46:43,840
know, in a very whatever.
And plango, you get something.

1863
01:46:44,400 --> 01:46:46,120
All right.
And that's a big flash.

1864
01:46:46,120 --> 01:46:48,320
OK, What did they do?
They started a fire.

1865
01:46:48,680 --> 01:46:50,560
You know, suddenly something
catches on fire.

1866
01:46:50,560 --> 01:46:53,600
Well, yeah, that can happen.
Things can catch on fire because

1867
01:46:53,600 --> 01:46:56,280
of what you do in your mind.
That's a real thing.

1868
01:46:56,720 --> 01:47:02,280
But the fact that it happens
randomly, OK, odd things happen

1869
01:47:02,960 --> 01:47:05,280
and they can happen randomly, so
some of those things are

1870
01:47:05,280 --> 01:47:07,720
probably real.
But in the movies, of course,

1871
01:47:07,720 --> 01:47:10,880
it's it's entirely different.
The movies are made just to be

1872
01:47:10,880 --> 01:47:12,440
entertaining, not to be
accurate.

1873
01:47:13,080 --> 01:47:17,600
So you know.
Experiences of like of accessing

1874
01:47:17,600 --> 01:47:19,680
this information.
Deja vu would be one of those,

1875
01:47:21,080 --> 01:47:22,920
yeah, Dave actually would be one
of those.

1876
01:47:22,920 --> 01:47:28,120
You, you could get information
from a time that you or somebody

1877
01:47:28,120 --> 01:47:31,160
you knew was there.
You could be collecting it out

1878
01:47:31,160 --> 01:47:35,640
of their mind or you could be
collecting out of the database

1879
01:47:35,640 --> 01:47:37,920
at a time you were there, maybe
in a past life even.

1880
01:47:37,920 --> 01:47:41,160
It would seem familiar to you.
So there's things like that that

1881
01:47:41,160 --> 01:47:44,200
would just, oh, this is so
familiar.

1882
01:47:44,200 --> 01:47:47,600
I know if I walk into the store
that I've never been in, I know

1883
01:47:47,600 --> 01:47:49,840
exactly what's going to be in
and that back counter all the

1884
01:47:49,840 --> 01:47:52,440
way in that thing, there's going
to be a an ice cream shop, you

1885
01:47:52,440 --> 01:47:54,800
know and over here and you walk
in and it is that way.

1886
01:47:54,800 --> 01:47:58,960
Well how would you know that?
Well, because you can get that

1887
01:47:58,960 --> 01:48:01,800
date of it get all that
information out of the database

1888
01:48:02,640 --> 01:48:07,840
and and the the deja vu might
just be that it's familiar

1889
01:48:07,840 --> 01:48:12,000
somewhere in your mind or it may
be totally by accident.

1890
01:48:12,600 --> 01:48:15,840
We we interpret things based on
pattern matching.

1891
01:48:16,720 --> 01:48:21,200
So if you were someplace
similar, if you'd seen a picture

1892
01:48:21,280 --> 01:48:24,880
that was very similar, if it had
been in a movie someplace, you

1893
01:48:24,880 --> 01:48:27,040
know, and you saw some picture
that was similar and you had

1894
01:48:27,040 --> 01:48:31,120
that in your mind as a pattern
and then you see it, you just

1895
01:48:31,320 --> 01:48:35,000
you pull that right out and you
might go in there and maybe no

1896
01:48:35,000 --> 01:48:36,400
ice cream thing back there at
all.

1897
01:48:36,440 --> 01:48:38,800
You you swore there must have
been, but it's not.

1898
01:48:39,080 --> 01:48:42,040
Well, that's because you pulled
out a pattern that was similar,

1899
01:48:42,040 --> 01:48:46,880
but it's not the right thing.
So we tend to pattern match

1900
01:48:47,240 --> 01:48:50,760
things, you know, and that's
causes us a lot of trouble.

1901
01:48:51,360 --> 01:48:53,600
You know, some of the Mandela
Effect is just a pattern

1902
01:48:53,600 --> 01:48:56,960
matching effect when you look at
a word.

1903
01:48:56,960 --> 01:48:59,440
You know, I don't know if you've
seen it on the Internet, but

1904
01:48:59,440 --> 01:49:02,280
there's a there's a place on the
Internet that comes around the

1905
01:49:02,280 --> 01:49:04,960
Internet every once in a while
where there'll be a paragraph

1906
01:49:04,960 --> 01:49:06,840
about maybe 10 lines or
something.

1907
01:49:07,200 --> 01:49:10,600
And what they've done is they
took every word that was in that

1908
01:49:10,600 --> 01:49:13,720
paragraph and they left the 1st
2 letters and the last two

1909
01:49:13,720 --> 01:49:16,160
letters alone.
And then they've randomly mixed

1910
01:49:16,280 --> 01:49:19,520
all the letters in between.
And of course, the question is,

1911
01:49:19,600 --> 01:49:22,760
can you read this?
Well, I read it.

1912
01:49:22,880 --> 01:49:24,880
I read the whole thing with no
trouble at all.

1913
01:49:24,880 --> 01:49:27,920
And if you'd asked me, did you
find any misspelled words, I'd

1914
01:49:27,920 --> 01:49:30,880
said no, everything looked fine.
I read it and it's perfectly

1915
01:49:30,880 --> 01:49:33,640
clear.
No, I wasn't trying to edit it

1916
01:49:33,680 --> 01:49:35,840
or, you know, look at it with
that kind of detail.

1917
01:49:36,240 --> 01:49:38,520
If I was, I would have found
every word misspelled.

1918
01:49:39,120 --> 01:49:42,040
But, well, I maybe not.
I'm not that great a speller,

1919
01:49:42,040 --> 01:49:44,840
but my spell checker would have
found every word misspelled.

1920
01:49:45,720 --> 01:49:47,920
Anyhow, when I looked at it, I
could read them.

1921
01:49:48,560 --> 01:49:50,720
It's pattern match.
You get a you get a pattern of

1922
01:49:50,720 --> 01:49:53,040
what a word is.
You see enough of that pattern

1923
01:49:53,040 --> 01:49:57,320
and you just grab that and you
go on and you may have grabbed

1924
01:49:57,320 --> 01:49:59,760
the wrong pattern because there
may be several things that have

1925
01:49:59,760 --> 01:50:03,240
the same 1st 2 letters in the
last two letters, but they have

1926
01:50:03,240 --> 01:50:05,760
different letters in between and
they mean different things.

1927
01:50:05,760 --> 01:50:08,000
And you could have done that,
you know you could have come up

1928
01:50:08,000 --> 01:50:11,640
with the wrong pattern.
So we we do that.

1929
01:50:11,640 --> 01:50:15,600
You know the the the Mandela
people that I had a little

1930
01:50:15,600 --> 01:50:20,040
conference with the Mandela
organization and I gave him like

1931
01:50:20,040 --> 01:50:23,160
4 different ways that
consciousness can create, you

1932
01:50:23,160 --> 01:50:25,760
know a Mandela Effect and that
was just one of them.

1933
01:50:26,720 --> 01:50:29,760
It's but there are four
different things to do it.

1934
01:50:29,760 --> 01:50:33,280
And the last one of course is
that sometimes the reality is

1935
01:50:33,280 --> 01:50:35,720
just squirrely.
The larger consciousness system

1936
01:50:35,960 --> 01:50:39,080
may just, you know, it's a data
stream you get and if it wants

1937
01:50:39,080 --> 01:50:42,360
to put little green men with
pointy ears in your data stream,

1938
01:50:42,360 --> 01:50:44,720
it can do that, you know.
And that's what you'll see.

1939
01:50:44,920 --> 01:50:49,120
And that will be your reality.
And it will be just as physical

1940
01:50:49,120 --> 01:50:51,320
as anything else because that's
what we get.

1941
01:50:51,320 --> 01:50:57,200
We get a data stream from the
server and we as a free will

1942
01:50:57,200 --> 01:51:00,800
awareness unit, we interpret
that data to be our reality.

1943
01:51:01,000 --> 01:51:04,760
And everybody lives in their own
reality because everybody gets a

1944
01:51:04,760 --> 01:51:08,240
data stream.
There is no reality out there.

1945
01:51:08,400 --> 01:51:12,480
You know, the Mandela Effect has
this assumption that there is a

1946
01:51:12,680 --> 01:51:17,840
true reality out there that is
some way, but it seems to change

1947
01:51:17,840 --> 01:51:19,800
from now, you know, now and
again.

1948
01:51:20,160 --> 01:51:25,200
But part of that problem is that
there is no reality out there.

1949
01:51:25,760 --> 01:51:28,840
There's definitely, you know,
there's 8 billion people here

1950
01:51:28,840 --> 01:51:32,600
and there's 8 billion different
viewpoints of what reality is.

1951
01:51:33,120 --> 01:51:36,760
Each one is individual, but it's
a multiplayer game.

1952
01:51:36,760 --> 01:51:41,040
So the the game shows us each,
you know, shows you and I

1953
01:51:41,520 --> 01:51:44,520
sitting where we are and
connected because that's what

1954
01:51:44,520 --> 01:51:47,640
we're doing now.
So you know, it's a multiplayer

1955
01:51:47,640 --> 01:51:50,080
game.
Any multiplayer game, you get to

1956
01:51:50,080 --> 01:51:52,760
see the same thing that other
players are seeing.

1957
01:51:52,760 --> 01:51:54,840
You all see the same monster in
the same place.

1958
01:51:54,840 --> 01:51:57,760
You're all engaged in the same
battle, you know that that sort

1959
01:51:57,760 --> 01:52:00,120
of thing.
So, sure, there's lots of

1960
01:52:00,120 --> 01:52:04,880
similarities, but everybody gets
their own data stream.

1961
01:52:05,200 --> 01:52:08,480
And if the system wants to put
something squirrely in your data

1962
01:52:08,480 --> 01:52:12,200
stream, well, your reality is
just going to be different than

1963
01:52:12,200 --> 01:52:16,120
anybody else's.
And if it wants you to realize

1964
01:52:16,120 --> 01:52:21,000
that this reality is more than
just materialistic machine, then

1965
01:52:21,000 --> 01:52:23,320
it might just start putting some
very different things in

1966
01:52:23,320 --> 01:52:25,840
different people's realities.
Just the cause of Mandela

1967
01:52:25,840 --> 01:52:29,280
effects of the people say, you
know, reality isn't as buttoned

1968
01:52:29,280 --> 01:52:32,840
down as we thought.
It's kind of goofy sometimes.

1969
01:52:33,360 --> 01:52:35,880
Well, that just opens people's
minds, and it's a thing the

1970
01:52:35,880 --> 01:52:39,960
system would do just to help pry
open people's minds so they have

1971
01:52:39,960 --> 01:52:44,440
a little bigger picture.
So let's talk about the sort of

1972
01:52:44,440 --> 01:52:48,560
computational boundary of the
self within this avatar or

1973
01:52:49,200 --> 01:52:51,440
within this consciousness.
I mean, we've got this avatar,

1974
01:52:51,920 --> 01:52:54,560
it's got this consciousness.
This reality is governed by

1975
01:52:54,560 --> 01:52:57,920
information.
At what point is this avatar or

1976
01:52:57,920 --> 01:53:01,040
the player able to?
Go beyond this avatar.

1977
01:53:01,040 --> 01:53:03,000
So now we're heading into the
territory of out of body

1978
01:53:03,000 --> 01:53:04,840
experiences.
Let's define out of body

1979
01:53:04,840 --> 01:53:07,280
experience.
Because I've watched and I've

1980
01:53:07,280 --> 01:53:08,320
listened to many of your
podcast.

1981
01:53:08,320 --> 01:53:09,920
I see you.
You've gone through the history

1982
01:53:09,920 --> 01:53:11,240
of it.
For anyone who wants to listen

1983
01:53:11,240 --> 01:53:13,400
to those they can, the Pad
Monroe Institute, all of that.

1984
01:53:13,400 --> 01:53:16,880
But for this one, let's focus on
the crux of the of the topic.

1985
01:53:17,000 --> 01:53:19,880
What is an out of body
experience and how does this

1986
01:53:19,880 --> 01:53:25,320
occur?
Out of body experience is most

1987
01:53:25,320 --> 01:53:31,000
accurately described as a single
player game that's been handed

1988
01:53:31,000 --> 01:53:35,360
to you by the LCS.
So your reality is a data

1989
01:53:35,360 --> 01:53:40,480
stream, and that data stream can
describe this virtual reality

1990
01:53:40,480 --> 01:53:43,600
that we call the physical
universe, but it doesn't have

1991
01:53:43,600 --> 01:53:45,400
to.
It can give you a data stream

1992
01:53:45,600 --> 01:53:49,840
that describes something else,
and that's something else then

1993
01:53:49,840 --> 01:53:54,400
becomes your reality.
OK, now that's the same thing

1994
01:53:54,400 --> 01:53:55,920
we're talking about in The
Mandela Effect.

1995
01:53:55,920 --> 01:53:58,960
Now you're just getting a
different data stream now.

1996
01:53:58,960 --> 01:54:04,080
So if you you can use this
meditation or you can maybe skip

1997
01:54:04,080 --> 01:54:06,360
meditation and use your your
imagination.

1998
01:54:06,760 --> 01:54:10,840
But if you get to the point that
you let the physical world go,

1999
01:54:10,840 --> 01:54:14,480
and what I mean by that, you
ignore the data stream that's

2000
01:54:14,480 --> 01:54:19,520
coming to you describing this
physical universe, OK, you just

2001
01:54:19,520 --> 01:54:23,640
ignore it.
So you don't process any of that

2002
01:54:23,640 --> 01:54:25,280
data.
Mostly people do that through

2003
01:54:25,280 --> 01:54:27,680
meditation.
They'll get into a meditation

2004
01:54:27,680 --> 01:54:30,720
state and they will stop
processing physical data.

2005
01:54:30,720 --> 01:54:33,160
And when they do, remember that
point, consciousness.

2006
01:54:33,160 --> 01:54:35,320
All you are is a piece of
consciousness aware that you're

2007
01:54:35,320 --> 01:54:36,680
aware.
That's it.

2008
01:54:37,320 --> 01:54:42,040
Well, when you get to that
point, the larger conscious

2009
01:54:42,040 --> 01:54:46,960
system can, if you want, if you
intend to, you can get another

2010
01:54:46,960 --> 01:54:52,160
data stream where you are out
flying around, you're in places,

2011
01:54:52,360 --> 01:54:53,920
you're going different kind of
places.

2012
01:54:53,920 --> 01:54:56,360
And you think, well, I'd rather
go over there, see what that is

2013
01:54:56,360 --> 01:54:59,480
and you fly over there and you
see what that is and you run

2014
01:54:59,480 --> 01:55:01,280
into people and you interact
with them.

2015
01:55:01,280 --> 01:55:03,640
And you know, so you have this
big experience.

2016
01:55:04,080 --> 01:55:08,520
It's just a single player game.
You're now getting a data stream

2017
01:55:08,920 --> 01:55:13,480
that's defining a different
reality that is not this virtual

2018
01:55:13,480 --> 01:55:16,560
reality, it's some other virtual
reality that's being played for

2019
01:55:16,560 --> 01:55:19,600
you.
And that's all an out of body

2020
01:55:19,600 --> 01:55:22,160
is.
That's basically what your lucid

2021
01:55:22,160 --> 01:55:26,000
dream is, except one of them.
You never lose consciousness.

2022
01:55:26,640 --> 01:55:30,600
You go from awaken this reality
to awaken another reality, and

2023
01:55:30,600 --> 01:55:32,560
the other one you lose
consciousness first and then

2024
01:55:32,560 --> 01:55:35,000
wake up and you're in a
different reality.

2025
01:55:35,000 --> 01:55:37,160
You're not in the physical
reality anymore.

2026
01:55:37,920 --> 01:55:43,120
So it's just kind of different
entry process for each one, but

2027
01:55:43,120 --> 01:55:44,960
it both takes you to the same
place.

2028
01:55:44,960 --> 01:55:49,840
Now the thing about data streams
is that you get a data stream.

2029
01:55:50,440 --> 01:55:52,920
Your reality isn't that data
stream.

2030
01:55:52,920 --> 01:55:56,480
Your reality is your
interpretation of that data

2031
01:55:56,480 --> 01:55:59,560
stream.
You get the data, but you have

2032
01:55:59,560 --> 01:56:03,160
to interpret it Now.
Interpreting it has some

2033
01:56:03,160 --> 01:56:06,720
problems.
It depends on your level of

2034
01:56:06,720 --> 01:56:10,720
fear, your level of knowledge,
your intellect, your you know

2035
01:56:10,720 --> 01:56:16,200
everything, your emotions, all
that defines you will impact and

2036
01:56:16,200 --> 01:56:22,040
colour how you interpret it it.
And you have to interpret it

2037
01:56:22,480 --> 01:56:30,040
into things, into metaphors that
are physical for the most part,

2038
01:56:30,480 --> 01:56:33,160
because that's how you think.
That's what your language does.

2039
01:56:33,440 --> 01:56:37,360
Our language is a language that
describes things physical well,

2040
01:56:37,360 --> 01:56:40,640
not always we can describe
feelings, we can describe other

2041
01:56:40,640 --> 01:56:42,640
things.
So you'll have feelings, so you

2042
01:56:42,640 --> 01:56:47,480
just, but you have to put it
into the same context as which

2043
01:56:47,480 --> 01:56:51,960
you put your interpretation of
this physical matter, Reality,

2044
01:56:52,600 --> 01:56:56,000
that virtual reality, because
that's where your language is,

2045
01:56:56,480 --> 01:57:00,240
that's where your thoughts are.
And without the language, you

2046
01:57:00,240 --> 01:57:02,680
can't put your thoughts in any
kind of an order to express

2047
01:57:02,680 --> 01:57:05,400
them.
If you can't express them, you

2048
01:57:05,400 --> 01:57:07,200
can't express them to yourself
either.

2049
01:57:07,680 --> 01:57:10,120
Then they're just vague kind of
feelings and things.

2050
01:57:10,120 --> 01:57:11,880
And wow, that was really
something.

2051
01:57:11,880 --> 01:57:15,120
But I can't explain it, you
know, I don't have any words for

2052
01:57:15,120 --> 01:57:17,800
it.
Well, that's because you don't

2053
01:57:17,800 --> 01:57:22,280
have any patterns already in
your system to match it to.

2054
01:57:23,000 --> 01:57:27,920
So you just, you're lost there.
But you match it to some pattern

2055
01:57:27,960 --> 01:57:30,520
that you've already got.
So if you're having a

2056
01:57:30,520 --> 01:57:33,280
conversation with somebody, you
match that to a pattern of a

2057
01:57:33,280 --> 01:57:36,520
humanoid, because that's what
you usually talk to, this

2058
01:57:36,520 --> 01:57:38,480
humanoid things.
You don't talk to chickens, you

2059
01:57:38,480 --> 01:57:41,160
don't talk to dogs, you don't
talk to rocks.

2060
01:57:41,480 --> 01:57:45,560
So you're having a conversation.
You'll pattern that as a

2061
01:57:45,560 --> 01:57:48,680
humanoid, and if you want to see
who you're talking to, you'll

2062
01:57:48,680 --> 01:57:51,040
see kind of a human shape.
It'll have a head and arms and

2063
01:57:51,040 --> 01:57:54,280
legs and probably be in a robe
with a hood.

2064
01:57:54,480 --> 01:57:58,040
So you don't have to conjure up
all the detail unless you really

2065
01:57:58,040 --> 01:57:59,640
want to.
It just makes it simpler.

2066
01:58:00,240 --> 01:58:05,560
And so that's what you'll get.
But you see, you'll see that as

2067
01:58:05,560 --> 01:58:09,520
a person and you're having this
conversation and then you'll

2068
01:58:09,520 --> 01:58:12,400
say, oh, I went to some place
and I met this guy George.

2069
01:58:12,760 --> 01:58:15,480
And George told me all kinds of
interesting things about where

2070
01:58:15,480 --> 01:58:19,040
he lives.
OK well, basically the reason

2071
01:58:19,040 --> 01:58:21,800
you saw George the way you saw
him is because that was your

2072
01:58:21,800 --> 01:58:23,880
best pattern match for somebody
who'll talk to you.

2073
01:58:24,920 --> 01:58:29,760
George may have been a a, a
three headed giraffe or

2074
01:58:29,760 --> 01:58:32,080
something, but you wouldn't
have, you wouldn't have made

2075
01:58:32,080 --> 01:58:33,960
that match.
You wouldn't have interpreted it

2076
01:58:33,960 --> 01:58:37,000
that way.
So it's your interpretation of

2077
01:58:37,000 --> 01:58:41,200
the data that you get.
And your interpretation is

2078
01:58:41,200 --> 01:58:48,040
colored by all kinds of things.
So how do you get better is you.

2079
01:58:48,600 --> 01:58:53,520
You develop the skills again,
that detaches you from all that

2080
01:58:53,520 --> 01:58:56,680
stuff that's yours.
You know from, from all that

2081
01:58:56,680 --> 01:59:00,840
fear and ideas and beliefs.
And you try to get rid of all

2082
01:59:00,840 --> 01:59:05,080
your beliefs, try to offload all
your fear and try to get as

2083
01:59:05,080 --> 01:59:07,400
clean as possible.
And then you want to be in a

2084
01:59:07,400 --> 01:59:10,240
detached state where you're not
thinking of anything and your

2085
01:59:10,240 --> 01:59:13,800
mind is clear.
And now your interpretation will

2086
01:59:13,800 --> 01:59:18,600
be closer to what the data
actually was giving you, You

2087
01:59:18,600 --> 01:59:23,040
see, So again, there's people
who are good at it and very good

2088
01:59:23,040 --> 01:59:26,600
at it and not so good at it, but
everybody thinks they're good at

2089
01:59:26,600 --> 01:59:28,920
it, You know, everybody thinks
that what they saw, that's what

2090
01:59:28,920 --> 01:59:31,200
was there.
There was this guy there and he

2091
01:59:31,200 --> 01:59:34,040
had this robe on and he said the
most amazing things.

2092
01:59:34,040 --> 01:59:38,120
And here's what he said.
You know they'll say that, but

2093
01:59:38,120 --> 01:59:42,000
that's you have to realize
that's their interpretation of

2094
01:59:42,760 --> 01:59:44,880
what they got out of the data
stream.

2095
01:59:45,320 --> 01:59:50,000
If that data stream gives you
things that you've got no

2096
01:59:50,000 --> 01:59:54,320
pattern match at all for, you
probably won't even remember it,

2097
01:59:55,640 --> 01:59:59,560
because you won't have any way
to put it into a language that

2098
01:59:59,560 --> 02:00:03,360
you can describe it to yourself.
A lot of people do that.

2099
02:00:03,360 --> 02:00:05,400
They'll go in, they'll get into
a meditation space, they'll

2100
02:00:05,400 --> 02:00:07,920
disappear for an hour, come
back, and they don't have any

2101
02:00:07,920 --> 02:00:10,320
idea what they did or where
they've been.

2102
02:00:10,600 --> 02:00:13,320
Well, part of that is that it
wasn't anything that they could

2103
02:00:13,320 --> 02:00:14,960
pattern match.
They couldn't, they couldn't

2104
02:00:14,960 --> 02:00:18,680
bring it back.
It wasn't, you know, something

2105
02:00:18,680 --> 02:00:23,640
they could bring back.
So, and there's other reasons

2106
02:00:23,640 --> 02:00:27,840
that you might get that too.
But anyway, so that's what your

2107
02:00:27,840 --> 02:00:31,920
reality is like.
You tend to create your own

2108
02:00:31,920 --> 02:00:35,480
reality in several ways.
One way is how you interpret it.

2109
02:00:36,480 --> 02:00:39,640
OK, now if let's let's say
you're a depressed person, how

2110
02:00:39,640 --> 02:00:42,160
you interpret your reality is
everything sucks.

2111
02:00:42,640 --> 02:00:46,000
Everything is nasty.
Everybody has a problem, you

2112
02:00:46,000 --> 02:00:50,720
know, All you'll see is
negativity everywhere and

2113
02:00:50,720 --> 02:00:52,440
everything.
Somebody comes up and real

2114
02:00:52,440 --> 02:00:55,600
cheerily says, oh hi, have a
nice day.

2115
02:00:56,040 --> 02:00:58,200
You'll think, ah, what a slob.
He didn't mean that.

2116
02:00:58,520 --> 02:01:02,480
You see, you'll just find
something negative about it, and

2117
02:01:02,880 --> 02:01:06,080
you won't see that that was some
nice person just being nice.

2118
02:01:06,080 --> 02:01:09,640
You'll see it as just some jerk
who says stuff that he doesn't

2119
02:01:09,640 --> 02:01:15,120
really mean.
So you interpret it and it works

2120
02:01:15,120 --> 02:01:18,920
the other way.
If you're very positive, you

2121
02:01:19,120 --> 02:01:20,800
interpret everything as being
positive.

2122
02:01:20,800 --> 02:01:25,000
So your life gets to be really
good and happy because even if

2123
02:01:25,000 --> 02:01:27,640
something awful happens, you go,
well, it's a good opportunity

2124
02:01:27,640 --> 02:01:30,520
for me to learn something, all
right, How you know, what's the

2125
02:01:30,520 --> 02:01:32,720
best solution for that?
What's what's my best choice?

2126
02:01:33,080 --> 02:01:36,480
And you'll see it as a as a
challenge and a puzzle, and

2127
02:01:36,480 --> 02:01:40,560
that's growing.
That's even fun.

2128
02:01:40,560 --> 02:01:45,400
So even though it's something
terrible that happened, you turn

2129
02:01:45,400 --> 02:01:47,280
it around and make something
positive out of it.

2130
02:01:47,360 --> 02:01:50,800
It's an opportunity.
So then you say how's life And

2131
02:01:50,800 --> 02:01:52,400
you say it's great, Everything's
positive.

2132
02:01:52,400 --> 02:01:54,800
I'm learning, I'm growing.
I'm, you know, I'm doing things

2133
02:01:54,800 --> 02:01:58,040
well.
So you see, it's just a lot of

2134
02:01:58,040 --> 02:02:00,880
what your reality is comes from
you.

2135
02:02:01,520 --> 02:02:05,000
So in that way, you, you don't
create the data stream that

2136
02:02:05,000 --> 02:02:07,600
comes to you.
So you don't create your reality

2137
02:02:07,600 --> 02:02:11,680
that way.
You you create your own reality.

2138
02:02:11,680 --> 02:02:15,360
As much as you get to interpret
that data in whichever way that

2139
02:02:15,360 --> 02:02:21,600
it represents you the other way
you can you can modify your

2140
02:02:21,600 --> 02:02:24,000
realities with an intent to
modify the probability

2141
02:02:24,000 --> 02:02:26,080
distributions.
That's another way you can

2142
02:02:26,720 --> 02:02:34,280
change your reality.
So you guys have done some work,

2143
02:02:34,360 --> 02:02:37,040
I mean with the Bob Monroe
Institute and all this, the

2144
02:02:37,040 --> 02:02:38,280
things you've done in your
career.

2145
02:02:39,480 --> 02:02:42,800
I think the logical question
from all of this is is can we

2146
02:02:42,800 --> 02:02:44,680
test?
Let's say out of body

2147
02:02:44,680 --> 02:02:48,080
experiences.
Can we test these this access to

2148
02:02:48,080 --> 02:02:51,440
information and I I mean I know
you've done work on this, but

2149
02:02:51,440 --> 02:02:53,720
I'm just asking it in that way
so that people deeper

2150
02:02:53,720 --> 02:02:56,880
understanding.
If you want an objective test

2151
02:02:57,280 --> 02:03:00,120
test, that's that.
A physicist would say that's

2152
02:03:00,120 --> 02:03:03,840
solid data.
No, you won't do that because

2153
02:03:03,840 --> 02:03:06,080
everything's in the subjective
world.

2154
02:03:07,160 --> 02:03:11,280
The objective world doesn't
explain things in a subjective

2155
02:03:11,280 --> 02:03:12,840
world, that's that's just the
nature.

2156
02:03:12,840 --> 02:03:14,040
The two of those things are
different.

2157
02:03:14,040 --> 02:03:16,440
Subjective means it happens in
your own mind.

2158
02:03:16,840 --> 02:03:19,680
It's your it's your attitude,
it's your feeling, it's the it's

2159
02:03:21,840 --> 02:03:27,000
you know that is not susceptible
to an objective test.

2160
02:03:27,280 --> 02:03:30,440
Now you can make some objective
test.

2161
02:03:30,440 --> 02:03:34,400
You can hook them up to A to an
EEG and watch the brain waves.

2162
02:03:34,400 --> 02:03:37,520
You can hook them up to an MRI
or something and look at the

2163
02:03:37,960 --> 02:03:41,040
look at the the heat, their
blood flow and their brain.

2164
02:03:41,040 --> 02:03:45,320
And you know, you've seen those
kind of patterns of people and

2165
02:03:45,800 --> 02:03:48,520
and you can find similarities
there and say, oh look, this

2166
02:03:48,520 --> 02:03:50,760
lobe just lit up.
That means they're thinking

2167
02:03:50,760 --> 02:03:53,120
about things.
But exactly what they're

2168
02:03:53,120 --> 02:03:58,600
thinking about isn't going to be
clear, You know, so some general

2169
02:03:58,600 --> 02:04:03,280
things you can you can monitor.
But from somebody to come back

2170
02:04:03,280 --> 02:04:06,000
and say, oh, I talked to some
guy that his name was Fred and

2171
02:04:06,200 --> 02:04:09,120
you know, he had a robe on and
he told me all these wonderful

2172
02:04:09,120 --> 02:04:11,120
things.
There's no way that the

2173
02:04:11,120 --> 02:04:13,720
objective was going to say, oh,
that was just a lot of crap.

2174
02:04:15,200 --> 02:04:18,360
Now they'll they'll say that
anyway, just because they figure

2175
02:04:18,480 --> 02:04:23,560
anything that is an objective is
undefined and therefore, you

2176
02:04:23,560 --> 02:04:26,960
know, a load of crap.
But they won't say that from

2177
02:04:26,960 --> 02:04:28,760
knowledge.
That's just their belief.

2178
02:04:29,640 --> 02:04:33,000
But it may not be a load of
crap, because when the probably

2179
02:04:33,000 --> 02:04:38,120
isn't, the reason it's important
is that the larger conscious

2180
02:04:38,120 --> 02:04:43,440
system is trying to raise its
own quality of consciousness.

2181
02:04:43,440 --> 02:04:45,720
It's trying to, you know, lower
its entropy.

2182
02:04:46,440 --> 02:04:49,000
We are part of its strategy for
doing that.

2183
02:04:49,360 --> 02:04:53,000
Therefore, it has incentive to
be helpful to us, to help us

2184
02:04:53,000 --> 02:04:55,760
succeed.
So it's not an uninterested

2185
02:04:55,760 --> 02:05:00,160
party that just says, OK, UIUSE,
you know, go do whatever you do,

2186
02:05:00,160 --> 02:05:02,320
leave me alone.
It's not like that.

2187
02:05:02,320 --> 02:05:06,040
It has a vested interest in US
succeeding and growing up.

2188
02:05:06,480 --> 02:05:10,000
So when you do an out of body
and the system sends you a data

2189
02:05:10,000 --> 02:05:13,240
stream, that data stream isn't
just something to entertain you.

2190
02:05:13,320 --> 02:05:15,360
The system's not interested in
entertaining you.

2191
02:05:15,640 --> 02:05:17,640
It's something that will help
you grow up.

2192
02:05:18,120 --> 02:05:19,920
It's something that will teach
you something.

2193
02:05:19,920 --> 02:05:23,160
You just have to find a lesson
in it, you see.

2194
02:05:23,440 --> 02:05:26,360
So when you if you do a lot of
out of body and you pay

2195
02:05:26,360 --> 02:05:30,800
attention, then you'll learn a
lot and you will grow up for it

2196
02:05:30,800 --> 02:05:35,880
because that out of body
experience was meant to help you

2197
02:05:36,360 --> 02:05:38,920
grow up.
So to say that, well, we

2198
02:05:38,920 --> 02:05:41,760
couldn't, couldn't measure it
directly from the objective

2199
02:05:41,760 --> 02:05:42,960
world.
So it's meaningless.

2200
02:05:43,760 --> 02:05:46,920
It's not meaningless at all on
that intuitive side.

2201
02:05:46,920 --> 02:05:49,880
There's lots of meaning on that
intuitive side.

2202
02:05:50,880 --> 02:05:53,280
There's lots of significance.
We already said that you know

2203
02:05:53,280 --> 02:05:55,800
the most significance and
meaning in your life is on that

2204
02:05:55,800 --> 02:05:57,640
side.
That's where meaning and

2205
02:05:57,640 --> 02:06:00,840
significance lives.
And if you get that through

2206
02:06:00,840 --> 02:06:03,720
consciousness, then it can be
very meaningful.

2207
02:06:04,000 --> 02:06:07,440
But now let's say that on your
intuitive side, you're not very

2208
02:06:07,440 --> 02:06:10,440
skilled at it.
So the fact that you can create

2209
02:06:10,440 --> 02:06:14,720
information and then feed that
information back to you, well,

2210
02:06:14,760 --> 02:06:18,560
you may have made it all up.
That guy you saw and what he

2211
02:06:18,560 --> 02:06:23,160
said, if that was something me
you could have made-up entirely

2212
02:06:24,400 --> 02:06:27,880
or you could have been getting
that from some other person,

2213
02:06:28,840 --> 02:06:31,280
some other consciousness could
have been feeding you that

2214
02:06:31,280 --> 02:06:33,880
information.
Now that's the most unlikely

2215
02:06:33,880 --> 02:06:36,960
because we don't sit around and
try to feed information like

2216
02:06:36,960 --> 02:06:39,000
that to other people.
So that's a very low

2217
02:06:39,000 --> 02:06:42,080
probability.
But the other two aren't so low

2218
02:06:42,360 --> 02:06:45,560
that you can make it up yourself
or it can come from the larger

2219
02:06:45,560 --> 02:06:50,400
consciousness system.
And the bad news is there's no

2220
02:06:50,840 --> 02:06:55,240
tag on that.
The various sources, you know,

2221
02:06:55,240 --> 02:06:57,880
those three sources don't come
with a little tag that says, oh,

2222
02:06:57,880 --> 02:07:00,040
this is from you and this is
from the larger conscious

2223
02:07:00,040 --> 02:07:03,040
system.
It's just data because sometimes

2224
02:07:03,040 --> 02:07:06,760
it's a mixture.
You get stuff from the larger

2225
02:07:06,760 --> 02:07:09,400
conscious system.
And then because it triggers

2226
02:07:09,400 --> 02:07:12,600
some of your own stuff, you
start adding or subtracting and

2227
02:07:12,600 --> 02:07:16,800
putting stuff in it.
You know, that happens most of

2228
02:07:16,800 --> 02:07:19,040
the time.
So when you get somebody's

2229
02:07:19,040 --> 02:07:22,400
writing a book about his out of
body experiences, you're seeing

2230
02:07:22,760 --> 02:07:28,440
some of what he got in his data
stream and you're seeing a lot

2231
02:07:28,440 --> 02:07:33,480
of what his reaction to that
stuff came comes out of his own

2232
02:07:33,480 --> 02:07:37,640
self and what he turns it into
and his pattern matches and what

2233
02:07:37,880 --> 02:07:42,480
comes out of it and his
metaphors to explain it are all

2234
02:07:42,480 --> 02:07:45,440
his.
So you have to kind of read

2235
02:07:45,440 --> 02:07:48,840
between the lines.
You'll see what was really going

2236
02:07:48,840 --> 02:07:50,360
on there.
And some of the time you just

2237
02:07:50,360 --> 02:07:52,520
can't tell you know where it's
coming from.

2238
02:07:53,160 --> 02:07:55,280
That's again, it depends on the
practitioner.

2239
02:07:55,360 --> 02:08:00,440
You can be very good at
separating those three, you know

2240
02:08:00,440 --> 02:08:04,800
those three different sources.
You can be just with experience.

2241
02:08:04,800 --> 02:08:08,560
You learn they feel different.
They come at you different ways.

2242
02:08:08,840 --> 02:08:12,160
They have different brown,
different color to them, you

2243
02:08:12,160 --> 02:08:15,680
know, so you can separate them.
If you're not very experienced,

2244
02:08:15,680 --> 02:08:18,280
you can't separate them.
They're all they all look like

2245
02:08:18,280 --> 02:08:21,480
exactly the same thing.
But you can never, even with a

2246
02:08:21,480 --> 02:08:25,840
lot of experience, separate them
with with no uncertainty.

2247
02:08:26,160 --> 02:08:29,600
They'll always be some
uncertainty because the larger

2248
02:08:29,600 --> 02:08:34,120
consciousness system is clever
enough to be able to mimic

2249
02:08:34,120 --> 02:08:39,360
things that will set you off to
be one thing when it's not.

2250
02:08:39,880 --> 02:08:43,440
You know, it's you can't say, Oh
well, I know that came from

2251
02:08:43,440 --> 02:08:46,200
another source.
You don't know that for sure.

2252
02:08:46,200 --> 02:08:48,400
It seems that way.
It's the way the other source

2253
02:08:48,400 --> 02:08:51,760
usually is.
But the larger conscious system

2254
02:08:52,120 --> 02:08:57,160
is the master of everything
because it's in charge of the,

2255
02:08:57,360 --> 02:08:59,240
you know, it's creating the
reality.

2256
02:08:59,600 --> 02:09:03,200
It can do what it will.
It wants to help you learn, and

2257
02:09:03,200 --> 02:09:06,320
it will give you things that
give you opportunities to learn.

2258
02:09:06,600 --> 02:09:10,120
It can't make you learn.
You have to find the opportunity

2259
02:09:10,120 --> 02:09:13,400
and then learn from it.
You know, I don't know if we

2260
02:09:13,400 --> 02:09:16,160
mentioned this before, but you
know, a lot of a lot of young

2261
02:09:16,160 --> 02:09:20,160
guys, when they're in their 20s
and 30s and going into their

2262
02:09:20,160 --> 02:09:23,240
40s, they go out of body and all
they do is fight.

2263
02:09:23,520 --> 02:09:27,280
You know, they have the they
have the sword of truth and you

2264
02:09:27,280 --> 02:09:29,920
know there's they're the good
guys and then there's the evil

2265
02:09:29,920 --> 02:09:32,480
people and they spend all their
time fighting evil.

2266
02:09:33,080 --> 02:09:36,360
Well, why is that?
It's because they're young guys

2267
02:09:36,360 --> 02:09:42,080
and and guys are protectors.
They're the ones that go out and

2268
02:09:42,320 --> 02:09:44,720
fight evil, you know, that's
kind of their role.

2269
02:09:44,960 --> 02:09:47,240
It's the way they see reality.
It's the way they see

2270
02:09:47,240 --> 02:09:50,920
themselves.
And most of all, the all the

2271
02:09:50,920 --> 02:09:53,640
evil that they fight is evil
that they create.

2272
02:09:54,160 --> 02:09:57,840
Those images are mostly coming
out of their own mind because

2273
02:09:57,840 --> 02:10:01,880
they're going out there looking
to Vanquish evil.

2274
02:10:02,800 --> 02:10:04,560
That's kind of the mindset they
have.

2275
02:10:04,560 --> 02:10:06,960
Well what do they see?
Oh, there's all kinds of evil

2276
02:10:06,960 --> 02:10:10,040
things all over.
And those things are a a

2277
02:10:10,040 --> 02:10:13,840
combination of what the system
gives them, which isn't that

2278
02:10:13,840 --> 02:10:17,920
much and mostly it's what they
create, it's how they how they

2279
02:10:17,920 --> 02:10:21,560
see evil.
So they spend a lot of time out,

2280
02:10:22,400 --> 02:10:26,600
you know, hacking, hacking evil
and making the world in the non

2281
02:10:26,600 --> 02:10:28,320
physical a better place for
everyone.

2282
02:10:30,400 --> 02:10:36,520
When the lesson is to let go of
that, that the fighting isn't

2283
02:10:36,520 --> 02:10:43,080
the not the way you know and
that they learn that there's

2284
02:10:43,080 --> 02:10:46,000
always another evil thing there,
you know, it's not like after

2285
02:10:46,000 --> 02:10:49,480
they're done now the non
physical world is all peaceful

2286
02:10:49,480 --> 02:10:51,040
and it's going to stay that way
forever.

2287
02:10:51,240 --> 02:10:53,880
Nope, there's always another
evil thing there because they're

2288
02:10:53,880 --> 02:10:58,600
going out to fight evil things.
So you see, it's kind of an

2289
02:10:58,600 --> 02:11:02,120
endless they're in an endless
loop there, and eventually

2290
02:11:02,120 --> 02:11:04,880
they're supposed to outgrow it,
get tired of it and look for

2291
02:11:04,880 --> 02:11:08,120
something more meaningful and
let it go.

2292
02:11:08,400 --> 02:11:10,440
And when they do, then they've
grown up a little bit.

2293
02:11:10,960 --> 02:11:17,560
So the system will and will
tailor stuff to you and your own

2294
02:11:17,560 --> 02:11:21,000
interests and will give you
things that will help you learn,

2295
02:11:21,840 --> 02:11:23,560
but it's not going to tell you
something.

2296
02:11:23,560 --> 02:11:27,120
It's not going to say hey, which
is soared down and and go think

2297
02:11:27,120 --> 02:11:29,920
of some other way, you know to
be helpful.

2298
02:11:30,600 --> 02:11:35,000
It's not all, it's not all about
fighting, not all about, you

2299
02:11:35,000 --> 02:11:38,760
know, power and force.
Force isn't the main way you

2300
02:11:38,760 --> 02:11:40,240
change things.
It's by force.

2301
02:11:40,760 --> 02:11:44,240
Mostly by force.
You either keep things the same,

2302
02:11:44,240 --> 02:11:47,280
you make things worse, you know
that's that's the typical

2303
02:11:47,520 --> 02:11:52,320
typical result of force.
And they have to.

2304
02:11:54,080 --> 02:11:57,240
They have to come to that
themselves in their own way.

2305
02:11:57,520 --> 02:12:00,760
With that, with that nice
background in mind, Tom, tell me

2306
02:12:02,760 --> 02:12:04,800
what did you guys do?
I mean, because you guys have

2307
02:12:04,800 --> 02:12:07,480
done so much work over time,
what was the thought process

2308
02:12:07,480 --> 02:12:11,720
behind trying to test these out
of body, body experiences and

2309
02:12:12,840 --> 02:12:15,440
what were the results for all of
those who are not familiar with

2310
02:12:15,440 --> 02:12:22,000
your work?
Well, first of all, we used the

2311
02:12:22,000 --> 02:12:27,560
out of body almost exclusively
to do things that were

2312
02:12:28,040 --> 02:12:31,840
Evidential.
And let us say, Dennis and I

2313
02:12:31,840 --> 02:12:36,040
would go out and we'd get into
bed and we would spend probably

2314
02:12:36,040 --> 02:12:40,360
2/3 of our time doing things
Evidential and another third of

2315
02:12:40,360 --> 02:12:43,480
our time just going out and
experiencing what we could

2316
02:12:43,480 --> 02:12:45,240
experience, you know, just kind
of exploring.

2317
02:12:46,280 --> 02:12:50,280
And that's because you don't get
any evidence that what you're

2318
02:12:50,280 --> 02:12:54,720
doing is real when you just go
out and explore because it's,

2319
02:12:55,000 --> 02:12:56,800
you know, there's no feedback
there.

2320
02:12:57,600 --> 02:13:01,360
It's either you know, you either
did or you created it or you

2321
02:13:01,360 --> 02:13:04,760
never know.
So what we did is we spent most

2322
02:13:04,760 --> 02:13:07,760
of our time doing things like
remote viewing.

2323
02:13:08,120 --> 02:13:10,560
You immediately get your answer
is what you saw.

2324
02:13:10,560 --> 02:13:14,520
What was actually there?
Healing.

2325
02:13:15,240 --> 02:13:18,520
Because now that's medicine.
So you only get information

2326
02:13:18,520 --> 02:13:21,480
about how well you did after
you've done hundreds of people.

2327
02:13:21,480 --> 02:13:25,320
You know, you get a sense.
And some are never evidential,

2328
02:13:25,320 --> 02:13:27,840
like, oh, I worked on somebody's
headache and it went away.

2329
02:13:27,840 --> 02:13:29,400
Well, So what?
It might have just gone away

2330
02:13:29,400 --> 02:13:31,040
anyway.
You know, headaches come and go.

2331
02:13:31,600 --> 02:13:34,280
You have to.
But if you worked on 100 people

2332
02:13:34,280 --> 02:13:37,800
with headaches and 98 of them
went away immediately, well, now

2333
02:13:37,800 --> 02:13:40,120
that's different.
You know, that that's got some

2334
02:13:40,120 --> 02:13:42,000
kind of statistical significance
to it.

2335
02:13:42,840 --> 02:13:46,120
And if you worked on somebody
who had a chronic illness and

2336
02:13:46,120 --> 02:13:49,240
was all bent over and twisted up
and hadn't been able to walk

2337
02:13:49,760 --> 02:13:54,040
for, you know, 20 years, they've
been in a wheelchair, had to be

2338
02:13:54,040 --> 02:13:56,800
pushed around because their body
wasn't able to get out and walk.

2339
02:13:56,800 --> 02:14:00,280
And you worked on them and you
know, the next day after you

2340
02:14:00,280 --> 02:14:03,080
worked on them, they got up,
danced A jig and, you know, went

2341
02:14:03,120 --> 02:14:06,120
out, took a stroll in the park.
Well, now that's evidential,

2342
02:14:06,120 --> 02:14:09,560
even though it was just a one
off because something very, very

2343
02:14:09,560 --> 02:14:12,800
unusual happened and you did
something that was probably a

2344
02:14:12,800 --> 02:14:16,040
one in a million that it would
or one in a trillion even that

2345
02:14:16,040 --> 02:14:21,000
it would have taken place.
So after what, 20-30 years of

2346
02:14:21,000 --> 02:14:23,960
doing this, you come up with
enough statistics that will

2347
02:14:23,960 --> 02:14:29,840
convince you that it's real, You
are really affecting people, and

2348
02:14:29,840 --> 02:14:31,880
you can modify future
probability.

2349
02:14:32,200 --> 02:14:36,120
You can interact with with
entities and things that make

2350
02:14:36,120 --> 02:14:38,800
sense, give you information
that's valuable, teach you

2351
02:14:38,800 --> 02:14:45,400
things, and you learn that.
Often it's not what the the

2352
02:14:45,400 --> 02:14:50,440
lesson isn't so much in what an
entity might tell you as it is

2353
02:14:50,440 --> 02:14:54,160
in how you handled the
interaction, how you got there.

2354
02:14:54,160 --> 02:15:00,840
How good were you at at being
completely detached, and how

2355
02:15:00,840 --> 02:15:03,040
good were you at keeping your
own stuff out of it.

2356
02:15:03,040 --> 02:15:05,760
Because the conscious system,
when you're out of body, will

2357
02:15:05,760 --> 02:15:09,320
feed you a link and they'll feed
you stuff that resonates with

2358
02:15:09,320 --> 02:15:13,560
your own problems, with your own
issues, just to see for you to

2359
02:15:13,560 --> 02:15:19,400
practice, you know, being, you
know, not letting your issues

2360
02:15:19,400 --> 02:15:22,000
interfere.
So it gives you practice for

2361
02:15:22,000 --> 02:15:24,800
that.
And so the fact the actual, the

2362
02:15:24,800 --> 02:15:28,360
actual interaction wasn't what
was important.

2363
02:15:28,720 --> 02:15:32,600
What was important was that the
lesson gave you practice at

2364
02:15:32,600 --> 02:15:37,880
honing your control over your
own consciousness and controls,

2365
02:15:37,880 --> 02:15:42,000
not the quite words your your
ability to to make your

2366
02:15:42,000 --> 02:15:45,800
consciousness more efficient and
more useful to you.

2367
02:15:46,800 --> 02:15:51,360
So some of it were just lessons.
And you know, you don't realize

2368
02:15:51,360 --> 02:15:54,120
that in the beginning.
It's only with some perspective

2369
02:15:54,120 --> 02:15:56,400
later that you, you know,
understand those things.

2370
02:15:56,400 --> 02:15:58,880
But Dennis and I did a lot of
remote viewing.

2371
02:15:59,720 --> 02:16:02,240
We would be in the booze and Bob
would go over and write numbers

2372
02:16:02,240 --> 02:16:05,320
down on a on a chalkboard and we
were supposed to tell him what

2373
02:16:05,320 --> 02:16:09,440
the numbers were.
We would go to a friend's houses

2374
02:16:09,440 --> 02:16:12,560
and things and see what they
were doing and, you know, try to

2375
02:16:12,560 --> 02:16:14,720
pick up something unusual, you
know?

2376
02:16:14,720 --> 02:16:17,080
Oh, yeah, You were sitting on
the couch watching TV.

2377
02:16:17,080 --> 02:16:19,320
Well, yeah, that's what they do
every night, you know, That

2378
02:16:19,320 --> 02:16:22,080
doesn't mean anything, you know.
Well, what was that?

2379
02:16:22,080 --> 02:16:24,720
I saw something bright red right
in the middle of, right in the

2380
02:16:24,720 --> 02:16:26,640
middle of your bed.
You had some, you know, it's

2381
02:16:26,640 --> 02:16:28,960
just this big splash of bright
red right in the middle of your

2382
02:16:28,960 --> 02:16:30,880
bed.
And you call them up and and the

2383
02:16:30,880 --> 02:16:34,480
lady would say, oh, yeah, just
just today I bought a new pair

2384
02:16:34,480 --> 02:16:36,559
of red shoes and I had them
sitting in the middle of the

2385
02:16:36,559 --> 02:16:38,600
bed.
Well, bingo.

2386
02:16:38,600 --> 02:16:41,760
You see, you got that right.
You didn't necessarily see they

2387
02:16:41,760 --> 02:16:43,680
were shoes, but you got the
color.

2388
02:16:44,240 --> 02:16:48,280
And so we look for unusual
things like that.

2389
02:16:48,280 --> 02:16:54,200
And again, if you do that over
years, you do it thousands of

2390
02:16:54,200 --> 02:17:00,480
times, you start to develop a
sense of of the capability of

2391
02:17:00,480 --> 02:17:02,400
that these things are true and
real.

2392
02:17:02,959 --> 02:17:04,920
So it's not something you'll get
right away.

2393
02:17:04,920 --> 02:17:07,240
It's not like you can practice
this for a week and you'll know

2394
02:17:07,240 --> 02:17:09,959
whether it's, you know, real or
not.

2395
02:17:10,400 --> 02:17:15,080
It takes a long time with a lot
of data, but eventually you'll

2396
02:17:15,080 --> 02:17:21,840
get past the point of trying to
discover is it real some point.

2397
02:17:22,160 --> 02:17:27,000
For me, I was probably a couple
of couple of years into Bob and

2398
02:17:27,000 --> 02:17:29,920
Rose thing been on hundreds of
out of bodies and whatever.

2399
02:17:30,360 --> 02:17:32,559
And you know, I'm a scientist.
I'm hard to convince of things

2400
02:17:32,559 --> 02:17:35,440
like that.
You know, in my mind, you know,

2401
02:17:35,480 --> 02:17:39,799
it's a mental thing.
You know, maybe, yeah, I don't

2402
02:17:39,799 --> 02:17:42,040
know what it was.
But, you know, maybe there is

2403
02:17:42,040 --> 02:17:44,920
some other explanation for it,
you know, So I'm hard to

2404
02:17:44,920 --> 02:17:49,040
convince, but I was convinced.
I got to that point where I

2405
02:17:49,040 --> 02:17:50,559
didn't have to ask, is it real
anymore?

2406
02:17:50,559 --> 02:17:54,440
When Dennis and I both went out
together on a on an out of body

2407
02:17:54,639 --> 02:17:58,559
thing and we stayed with each
other and we both saw the same

2408
02:17:58,559 --> 02:18:01,959
things, We discussed things.
We had conversations and here we

2409
02:18:01,959 --> 02:18:04,320
were in two isolation booths
where we couldn't hear each

2410
02:18:04,320 --> 02:18:06,600
other, couldn't see each other.
We totally isolated.

2411
02:18:06,920 --> 02:18:08,959
Actually there are three booths
there, and I was in the first

2412
02:18:08,959 --> 02:18:11,040
one, he was in the last one.
So it was an empty booth between

2413
02:18:11,040 --> 02:18:13,680
US and all of them were
acoustically isolated.

2414
02:18:14,040 --> 02:18:16,600
The one I was in was
electromagnetically isolated,

2415
02:18:16,600 --> 02:18:21,920
was a Faraday cage and and we
were having conversations,

2416
02:18:21,920 --> 02:18:24,440
answering each other's
questions, looking at things,

2417
02:18:24,440 --> 02:18:28,200
having, you know, whatever,
because Bob had us report all

2418
02:18:28,200 --> 02:18:36,240
the things that happened and he
was recording both of those back

2419
02:18:36,240 --> 02:18:38,879
in those days.
It was on cassettes and he

2420
02:18:38,879 --> 02:18:41,040
recorded all that stuff.
So he had a cassette for me and

2421
02:18:41,040 --> 02:18:44,879
a cassette for Dennis and he, he
rewound them when we came out

2422
02:18:45,240 --> 02:18:47,879
and he started them both at the
same time so that they would be,

2423
02:18:47,879 --> 02:18:51,400
you know, they would be synced
in time and he played both of

2424
02:18:51,400 --> 02:18:54,280
them at the same time.
And here we were.

2425
02:18:54,280 --> 02:18:57,799
We were obviously together and
we obviously were talking, met

2426
02:18:57,799 --> 02:19:03,280
the same people, heard the same
things, yeah, So we had a outer

2427
02:19:03,280 --> 02:19:05,680
body together.
So exist.

2428
02:19:06,120 --> 02:19:11,360
Tom, do these tapes still exist?
I have looked for him.

2429
02:19:12,520 --> 02:19:17,559
Bob had them and I suspect that
they were probably kind of

2430
02:19:17,559 --> 02:19:20,000
special to Bob and he probably
put him in some, you know,

2431
02:19:20,000 --> 02:19:22,040
special place so he wouldn't get
lost.

2432
02:19:22,040 --> 02:19:26,559
But, you know, there was
literally thousands and

2433
02:19:26,559 --> 02:19:30,600
thousands of tapes.
And at the time, at the time,

2434
02:19:31,120 --> 02:19:33,480
there wasn't a whole lot of care
about what was done with him.

2435
02:19:33,480 --> 02:19:35,400
There was a great big box in a
closet.

2436
02:19:35,840 --> 02:19:40,639
And Bob taped everything every
session for everybody, no matter

2437
02:19:40,639 --> 02:19:42,000
if they just walked in off the
street.

2438
02:19:42,000 --> 02:19:44,120
And it was the first time that,
you know, he, he taped

2439
02:19:44,360 --> 02:19:46,559
everything.
He was collecting data.

2440
02:19:47,559 --> 02:19:50,360
But cassettes were pulled out
and thrown in the box, you know,

2441
02:19:50,360 --> 02:19:51,600
thrown in a box, thrown in the
box.

2442
02:19:51,600 --> 02:19:55,280
Pretty soon the box has thousand
cassettes in it.

2443
02:19:55,840 --> 02:20:01,360
And one day, I think after Bob
was probably passed on, all

2444
02:20:01,360 --> 02:20:04,960
those tapes were gathered up and
they got the box and they went

2445
02:20:04,960 --> 02:20:08,320
through them and tried to listen
to everyone and categorize it

2446
02:20:08,320 --> 02:20:10,160
and who was it and what were
they doing?

2447
02:20:10,440 --> 02:20:15,480
And they put a lot of effort
into trying to squeeze entropy

2448
02:20:15,720 --> 02:20:21,080
out of that, that mess of tapes.
And what they found was.

2449
02:20:22,200 --> 02:20:24,400
Two things.
One, some of them are really

2450
02:20:24,400 --> 02:20:27,080
hard to tell, you know, they
were hard to figure out what was

2451
02:20:27,080 --> 02:20:30,120
going on.
So those just weren't, you know,

2452
02:20:30,120 --> 02:20:33,880
they never went anywhere.
Some of them, the tapes were too

2453
02:20:33,880 --> 02:20:37,480
old because Bob had been, you
know, he'd been collecting his

2454
02:20:37,480 --> 02:20:46,000
tapes for, I don't know, 1520
years, a lot of time he, he had

2455
02:20:46,000 --> 02:20:48,600
a lot of lot of tapes, you know,
he'd been collecting.

2456
02:20:48,600 --> 02:20:52,760
There's more than one box, I
suspect, but anyhow, there were

2457
02:20:52,760 --> 02:20:56,040
so many of them, those tapes.
And he always bought the

2458
02:20:56,040 --> 02:20:59,000
cheapest tapes possible because
he went through so many of them.

2459
02:20:59,400 --> 02:21:01,560
Bob was a little stingy on
things like that.

2460
02:21:01,560 --> 02:21:05,440
And he would, he'd go to
RadioShack and he'd get tapes

2461
02:21:05,440 --> 02:21:09,520
that cost, you know, a dollar a
piece or something really good.

2462
02:21:09,520 --> 02:21:14,600
Cassettes were like $5 a piece,
but he'd, he'd buy a box of 50,

2463
02:21:14,840 --> 02:21:18,360
you know, such that there were,
you know, $0.75 apiece or

2464
02:21:18,360 --> 02:21:22,200
something.
So he was saving money, but he

2465
02:21:22,200 --> 02:21:23,800
didn't think about how long
they'd last.

2466
02:21:23,800 --> 02:21:28,120
Those cheap tapes were in very
cheap plastic, you know

2467
02:21:28,120 --> 02:21:31,160
cassettes.
And I'd say that a fair number

2468
02:21:31,160 --> 02:21:36,760
of them just were too old, too
brittle, didn't you know, they

2469
02:21:36,760 --> 02:21:39,080
just didn't play anymore.
You start to play them and the

2470
02:21:39,080 --> 02:21:41,000
tape would would fall apart
would.

2471
02:21:41,800 --> 02:21:45,480
So they did have a lot of them.
And if you go to the Munrosis,

2472
02:21:45,520 --> 02:21:47,800
you can look up tapes.
You can listen to me when I'm

2473
02:21:47,960 --> 02:21:50,360
when I was in that booth.
They've got some of my tapes in

2474
02:21:50,360 --> 02:21:54,320
there, but those particular
tapes never showed up.

2475
02:21:55,600 --> 02:21:58,000
And my guess is that Bob
probably has set him aside

2476
02:21:58,000 --> 02:22:02,000
because they were kind of
amazing and they got, who knows,

2477
02:22:02,000 --> 02:22:05,320
you know, after his death, who
knows what happened?

2478
02:22:05,320 --> 02:22:07,640
Maybe they just cleaned it out,
threw him in a garbage bag, You

2479
02:22:07,640 --> 02:22:10,160
know, it's hard to say.
There were so many tapes land

2480
02:22:10,160 --> 02:22:15,800
everywhere that like a needle in
a haystack, but they have tried.

2481
02:22:15,800 --> 02:22:19,000
I've asked him to go back and
look again and they have really

2482
02:22:19,000 --> 02:22:22,800
cooperated and put a lot of
effort in and they just can't

2483
02:22:23,000 --> 02:22:24,840
find that.
They didn't dig it out.

2484
02:22:24,840 --> 02:22:27,800
But Dennis is still alive.
He's still, he's a little older

2485
02:22:27,800 --> 02:22:31,120
than me, but he's still kicking
too.

2486
02:22:31,120 --> 02:22:36,640
So he he remembers it as well.
But other than that, now that

2487
02:22:37,360 --> 02:22:41,240
unfortunately those tapes don't
exist anymore.

2488
02:22:41,440 --> 02:22:44,440
When you look back, what do you
think Bob's intention?

2489
02:22:45,000 --> 02:22:47,800
For all this research and what
is the overarching theme and

2490
02:22:47,800 --> 02:22:52,960
goal?
Well, there's several different

2491
02:22:52,960 --> 02:22:57,440
ones.
Bob's was to try to make his out

2492
02:22:57,440 --> 02:23:02,760
of body experience legitimate.
He had these out of body

2493
02:23:02,760 --> 02:23:05,320
experiences and he knows most
people looked at him and said

2494
02:23:05,320 --> 02:23:08,440
that's just your imagination,
you know that's these are dreams

2495
02:23:08,440 --> 02:23:12,560
you're having and and whatever.
Most people blew it off as as

2496
02:23:13,960 --> 02:23:16,240
non consequential.
Didn't really mean anything, had

2497
02:23:16,240 --> 02:23:20,840
no significance and Bob knew
that it did because he had done

2498
02:23:20,840 --> 02:23:22,960
things and and collected
information.

2499
02:23:22,960 --> 02:23:25,720
You know, our remote viewing
wasn't just lying in the bed and

2500
02:23:25,720 --> 02:23:28,920
having our mind go remote view.
We'd go out of body and with our

2501
02:23:28,920 --> 02:23:34,520
outer body we would go someplace
and look at things and and and

2502
02:23:34,520 --> 02:23:36,640
then come back and see whether
what we said.

2503
02:23:36,640 --> 02:23:38,960
So it was it was that kind of a
thing.

2504
02:23:39,280 --> 02:23:42,760
So Bob knew that he had seen
things, gathered information

2505
02:23:42,760 --> 02:23:46,200
that was just impossible for him
to have, and that he found it

2506
02:23:46,200 --> 02:23:49,080
was correct.
So he was convinced that it was

2507
02:23:49,320 --> 02:23:54,600
absolutely true.
And he didn't try to do a lot of

2508
02:23:54,600 --> 02:23:58,080
analysis in his books.
His books were like a journal.

2509
02:23:58,520 --> 02:24:01,720
Here's what I experienced.
He didn't try to say.

2510
02:24:02,080 --> 02:24:05,840
And I interpreted, you know,
this is my interpretation and

2511
02:24:05,840 --> 02:24:09,280
this is what I think it meant.
He just said this is what I

2512
02:24:09,280 --> 02:24:13,600
experienced, and that was good
because he didn't really know

2513
02:24:13,600 --> 02:24:16,160
how to interpret it or what it
meant.

2514
02:24:16,680 --> 02:24:21,200
But he wanted to learn more.
So he his motivation was he

2515
02:24:21,200 --> 02:24:24,840
wanted it to become more
legitimate, more science, you

2516
02:24:24,840 --> 02:24:27,600
know, research.
He wanted enough people doing it

2517
02:24:27,600 --> 02:24:31,320
to catalog it that you could
find things that were similar

2518
02:24:31,320 --> 02:24:35,240
and and trends.
And then he found, you know, we

2519
02:24:35,240 --> 02:24:39,360
we found the binaural beats and
had a really nice tool and then

2520
02:24:39,360 --> 02:24:42,080
suddenly he saw a a business
opportunity.

2521
02:24:42,080 --> 02:24:45,440
So then, you know, shortly after
that he created the, you know,

2522
02:24:45,480 --> 02:24:49,000
TMI, you know the Monroe
Institute and had people coming

2523
02:24:49,000 --> 02:24:53,120
and it began to pay for itself
because it all the first bunch

2524
02:24:53,120 --> 02:24:57,520
of years Bob funded everything.
Everything came out of Bob's

2525
02:24:57,520 --> 02:25:00,240
pocket and it didn't give
anything back, you know, it was

2526
02:25:00,240 --> 02:25:04,600
just his interest to find out.
So he found something that

2527
02:25:04,600 --> 02:25:06,800
would, that would give back and
maybe even have a little

2528
02:25:06,800 --> 02:25:10,000
leftover, you know, pay for
staff and other things.

2529
02:25:10,000 --> 02:25:12,640
And that was good.
It kind of raised the whole game

2530
02:25:12,640 --> 02:25:15,320
to a little higher level.
The more research you can you

2531
02:25:15,320 --> 02:25:18,040
can hire somebody just to do
research, you know.

2532
02:25:18,040 --> 02:25:22,160
So that's what TMI then started
teaching courses and doing other

2533
02:25:22,160 --> 02:25:24,880
things once they got a sound
that was really helpful for most

2534
02:25:24,880 --> 02:25:28,680
people.
So that was his, his idea.

2535
02:25:28,680 --> 02:25:33,240
Now mine was very different.
I'm a I'm a physicist.

2536
02:25:33,720 --> 02:25:36,840
What physics does is tries to
model reality.

2537
02:25:37,160 --> 02:25:40,720
We try to understand how does
reality work, what is reality

2538
02:25:40,720 --> 02:25:43,760
and how does it work.
That's basically what physics is

2539
02:25:43,760 --> 02:25:47,520
all about.
So my motivation, I didn't

2540
02:25:47,520 --> 02:25:50,120
really care so much whether
anybody thought I was crazy or

2541
02:25:50,120 --> 02:25:52,680
not that or whether they, you
know, Bob did, he didn't want to

2542
02:25:52,680 --> 02:25:54,920
be seen as crazy.
He wanted it to be legitimate.

2543
02:25:55,240 --> 02:25:57,480
I didn't really care what other
people thought.

2544
02:25:57,680 --> 02:26:02,920
I wanted to understand it.
I wanted to to understand why is

2545
02:26:02,920 --> 02:26:06,560
it like that?
OK, this works and that works,

2546
02:26:06,680 --> 02:26:10,920
but why and why are they limits?
And why do you heal some people

2547
02:26:10,920 --> 02:26:13,480
and not others?
And why do you sometimes get

2548
02:26:13,480 --> 02:26:17,800
your remote viewing wrong and
what are the parameters

2549
02:26:17,800 --> 02:26:22,840
involved?
How significant is your altered

2550
02:26:22,840 --> 02:26:25,720
state or the preparation that
you do going into it?

2551
02:26:25,720 --> 02:26:28,640
Or can you skip all that stuff?
So I had just thousands of

2552
02:26:28,640 --> 02:26:34,040
questions that wanted to
scientifically find out what was

2553
02:26:34,040 --> 02:26:37,720
going on.
So my whole point in it was find

2554
02:26:37,720 --> 02:26:41,080
a model, find a way to describe
it.

2555
02:26:41,080 --> 02:26:44,960
So I tried looking at the
literature, you know, and we'd,

2556
02:26:45,320 --> 02:26:47,720
you know, read everything that I
could find written about it, and

2557
02:26:47,720 --> 02:26:51,360
most of it was junk.
It wasn't you know, there was

2558
02:26:51,360 --> 02:26:55,960
very little science or stuff
that actually looked like facts

2559
02:26:55,960 --> 02:27:02,320
to me and the the one book I got
that seemed like it had an idea

2560
02:27:02,320 --> 02:27:06,760
but it was missing an awful lot
of of stuff was Seth Speaks.

2561
02:27:07,560 --> 02:27:10,600
Seth Speaks came out in the
early 70s and I read that and

2562
02:27:11,000 --> 02:27:13,160
you know, a lot of the stuff he
said was correct.

2563
02:27:13,720 --> 02:27:16,360
You know, it was, you know, we
live in a multi dimensional

2564
02:27:16,360 --> 02:27:18,120
reality.
We are fundamentally

2565
02:27:18,120 --> 02:27:20,440
consciousness.
We, you know, and he had all

2566
02:27:20,440 --> 02:27:22,080
these things.
And I said, huh, that's check,

2567
02:27:22,080 --> 02:27:24,560
check, check.
But then there was other things

2568
02:27:24,560 --> 02:27:27,560
he said that didn't check and
whatever.

2569
02:27:27,560 --> 02:27:32,280
So that was a that was at least
a start, but certainly not a

2570
02:27:32,280 --> 02:27:34,160
finish.
You know, at least I found

2571
02:27:34,160 --> 02:27:39,320
somebody that had some idea of
what it was like but not very

2572
02:27:39,320 --> 02:27:44,080
satisfactory in the big picture.
So I just kept working on it.

2573
02:27:44,680 --> 02:27:50,040
And after I left the Monroe,
Monroe kind of went off, you

2574
02:27:50,040 --> 02:27:52,280
know, on his direction.
And I went off of my own

2575
02:27:52,280 --> 02:27:55,040
direction, moved out of that
state, went someplace else.

2576
02:27:55,720 --> 02:28:00,000
And I just kept working at it
all the time, you know, every

2577
02:28:00,000 --> 02:28:03,880
night, you know, times I had.
And then I go to bed, I'd do a

2578
02:28:03,880 --> 02:28:07,840
meditation state and I'd start
doing doing things, you know,

2579
02:28:07,840 --> 02:28:11,560
Well, OK, I can understand this
part, but I can't understand

2580
02:28:11,840 --> 02:28:13,600
what this variable has to do
with it.

2581
02:28:13,600 --> 02:28:15,840
But I know when I change this
variable, it changes these

2582
02:28:15,840 --> 02:28:18,320
things.
So what's going on?

2583
02:28:18,320 --> 02:28:23,000
What's the model?
So given about 30 years of that

2584
02:28:23,600 --> 02:28:27,240
research, I finally got to the
point I thought I understood how

2585
02:28:27,240 --> 02:28:30,640
consciousness worked, and that's
when I wrote my books.

2586
02:28:30,640 --> 02:28:32,600
My books were really a model of
consciousness.

2587
02:28:32,920 --> 02:28:36,920
But I also knew that
consciousness was fundamental in

2588
02:28:36,920 --> 02:28:38,320
the physical world.
Was not.

2589
02:28:38,560 --> 02:28:43,560
And therefore physics had to be
derivable from an understanding

2590
02:28:43,560 --> 02:28:46,200
of consciousness, because
consciousness is fundamental and

2591
02:28:46,200 --> 02:28:47,560
the physics has to come out of
that.

2592
02:28:48,600 --> 02:28:53,800
So it wasn't until about two or
three years after my books were

2593
02:28:53,800 --> 02:28:57,280
published that I made that
connection and got the AHA to

2594
02:28:57,600 --> 02:29:01,120
understand how physics would be
derived from that.

2595
02:29:01,520 --> 02:29:04,320
So it took a while.
I've been learning things ever

2596
02:29:04,320 --> 02:29:06,760
since.
You know, I, I, I keep figuring

2597
02:29:06,760 --> 02:29:09,960
new things out all the time.
So it's not.

2598
02:29:09,960 --> 02:29:13,600
The books have been published
now for 20 years, you know, and

2599
02:29:14,160 --> 02:29:18,720
they were February 2003, they
were published and now we're

2600
02:29:18,760 --> 02:29:23,360
almost 23, you know, so are.
You planning on writing future

2601
02:29:23,360 --> 02:29:26,840
books, Tom?
Anything in the Well, I do have

2602
02:29:26,840 --> 02:29:30,640
a future book that I've been
working on that people keep

2603
02:29:30,640 --> 02:29:33,160
asking me how's it coming?
And it's not doing very well

2604
02:29:33,160 --> 02:29:35,120
because I'm so busy, I don't
have time.

2605
02:29:35,760 --> 02:29:38,960
My writing of books, I have to
sit down and have big blocks of

2606
02:29:38,960 --> 02:29:43,560
time where I'm not, you know,
I'm, I'm not interrupted and I'm

2607
02:29:43,560 --> 02:29:45,200
not engaged in doing other
things else.

2608
02:29:45,200 --> 02:29:48,360
But I'm not like that right now.
I've got, you know, 20 things to

2609
02:29:48,360 --> 02:29:50,080
do and I don't have the time to
do them all.

2610
02:29:50,080 --> 02:29:53,920
I'm in a constant, you know, on
the treadmill running, trying to

2611
02:29:53,920 --> 02:29:55,640
catch up to the things that I
have to do.

2612
02:29:55,640 --> 02:29:59,600
So I'm not writing any books
now, but it the, the, the name

2613
02:29:59,600 --> 02:30:03,760
of it is maybe surprise you and
that is primal man, primal

2614
02:30:03,760 --> 02:30:05,480
woman.
It's a book.

2615
02:30:05,920 --> 02:30:10,320
It's a book about gender and
essentially if you can strip off

2616
02:30:10,440 --> 02:30:14,680
all the cultural overlays and
just look at male and female in

2617
02:30:14,680 --> 02:30:19,000
their primal state without this
culture saying this is good and

2618
02:30:19,000 --> 02:30:20,400
that's bad.
And so just take all that

2619
02:30:20,400 --> 02:30:23,160
cultural stuff away from it.
What do you have in male and

2620
02:30:23,160 --> 02:30:27,800
female, what it what are they?
How do they, you know, how are

2621
02:30:27,800 --> 02:30:29,120
they the same?
How do they differ?

2622
02:30:29,120 --> 02:30:31,640
What is the, you know, what is
the relationship and how does it

2623
02:30:31,640 --> 02:30:36,200
work?
And I've written about 20 pages,

2624
02:30:36,200 --> 02:30:39,960
which was just a a brief outline
so that people would get a

2625
02:30:39,960 --> 02:30:41,320
little idea of where it was
going.

2626
02:30:41,320 --> 02:30:44,480
And that's my website.
I think you can go get that at

2627
02:30:44,480 --> 02:30:49,680
the read that at the website,
but that's maybe 5% or 10%, you

2628
02:30:49,680 --> 02:30:53,120
know I've got a whole lot more
in my head and I continue to

2629
02:30:53,120 --> 02:30:57,040
work on it all the time.
You know I get new insights and

2630
02:30:57,160 --> 02:31:00,320
kind of learn new things and
come to conclusions, but I just

2631
02:31:00,320 --> 02:31:03,680
haven't written any of it down.
I just wrote that a little bit

2632
02:31:03,680 --> 02:31:06,400
topic at.
The moment What?

2633
02:31:06,440 --> 02:31:08,280
What?
What's drawn you towards this

2634
02:31:08,280 --> 02:31:11,440
topic?
Oh, what's drawn me toward that

2635
02:31:11,440 --> 02:31:17,160
topic is that the reason I felt
compelled to write MBT in the

2636
02:31:17,160 --> 02:31:23,040
1st place about consciousness is
I saw that there was the great

2637
02:31:23,040 --> 02:31:28,520
majority of people in my
culture, and probably world

2638
02:31:28,520 --> 02:31:35,840
culture had no idea why were
they were here, what they were

2639
02:31:35,840 --> 02:31:39,880
supposed to be doing, the nature
of the reality they lived in,

2640
02:31:41,480 --> 02:31:43,920
the nature of the game that they
were involved in.

2641
02:31:43,920 --> 02:31:46,440
They're all wandering around, as
I said, clueless, you know, in

2642
02:31:46,440 --> 02:31:50,400
the playing field, not having
any idea what the game was, that

2643
02:31:50,760 --> 02:31:55,160
most of our dysfunction, you
know, power, control, force,

2644
02:31:55,160 --> 02:31:58,920
greed, all that stuff.
Most of that dysfunction was

2645
02:31:58,920 --> 02:32:02,440
because they didn't understand
the nature of reality and how

2646
02:32:02,440 --> 02:32:06,040
things worked.
And that if I could, if I could

2647
02:32:06,040 --> 02:32:10,200
spread that information about
what is consciousness and what's

2648
02:32:10,200 --> 02:32:13,680
it trying to do and, you know,
where's it going and what are

2649
02:32:13,680 --> 02:32:17,480
you really?
Then I thought it would change

2650
02:32:17,480 --> 02:32:21,560
the world in the sense that we
would produce a kind of centler,

2651
02:32:21,560 --> 02:32:25,200
more supportive, more
sustainable world.

2652
02:32:25,720 --> 02:32:30,400
And as we grew up, we would also
be better caretakers of the

2653
02:32:30,400 --> 02:32:34,600
environment and of each other.
So I thought that that

2654
02:32:34,600 --> 02:32:41,600
information was sorely needed.
People needed to understand the

2655
02:32:41,600 --> 02:32:44,400
bigger picture that they were in
and why.

2656
02:32:44,400 --> 02:32:47,720
And it's not just that, oh, love
is the answer, That's sweet,

2657
02:32:47,720 --> 02:32:49,320
that's nice.
But, you know, it's just the

2658
02:32:49,320 --> 02:32:51,840
saying that people say because
it sounds nice, but it doesn't

2659
02:32:51,840 --> 02:32:55,360
really mean anything really.
The words, you know the world is

2660
02:32:55,360 --> 02:33:01,560
a is a very a very rough very
tough existence where

2661
02:33:01,560 --> 02:33:04,120
everybody's trying to do
control, power force on

2662
02:33:04,120 --> 02:33:07,200
everybody else.
And it's a mean place it's the

2663
02:33:07,200 --> 02:33:11,040
mean streets and it doesn't have
to be that way.

2664
02:33:11,040 --> 02:33:14,240
We create it that way.
That's our creation because

2665
02:33:14,240 --> 02:33:18,040
that's what we are that's it's
all the grown and what the more

2666
02:33:18,040 --> 02:33:20,520
grown we are.
So I saw that in the bigger

2667
02:33:20,520 --> 02:33:27,600
picture, people now would not be
able to go to a place if they

2668
02:33:27,600 --> 02:33:31,080
didn't have a logical scientific
road map to get there.

2669
02:33:31,800 --> 02:33:37,960
You know back what, 1000 years
ago, the high priests of our

2670
02:33:37,960 --> 02:33:41,400
culture were priests, and it was
religion that told people what

2671
02:33:41,400 --> 02:33:43,880
was right and what was wrong and
what to believe and what not to

2672
02:33:43,880 --> 02:33:46,280
believe.
And a lot of that turned out to

2673
02:33:46,280 --> 02:33:48,400
be control, power and force as
well.

2674
02:33:50,080 --> 02:33:53,080
But I knew that just to paint a
pretty picture, you know, we

2675
02:33:53,080 --> 02:33:55,200
could all just get along better.
It'd be nice.

2676
02:33:55,800 --> 02:33:58,760
It's totally ineffectual.
That doesn't do anything that's

2677
02:33:58,760 --> 02:34:00,680
not going to help anybody.
Everybody go, uh, huh, uh, huh.

2678
02:34:01,200 --> 02:34:03,160
But that's not the kind of world
it is, Tom.

2679
02:34:03,160 --> 02:34:08,480
You know, join the real world.
But if they actually understood

2680
02:34:08,720 --> 02:34:12,800
what this reality was about the
game they were in, how it works,

2681
02:34:12,800 --> 02:34:17,120
why it works that way.
Now that's a logical scientific

2682
02:34:17,120 --> 02:34:21,320
approach that people could buy
into because it made sense.

2683
02:34:21,320 --> 02:34:25,680
It explained things, and it not
only explained things in, you

2684
02:34:25,680 --> 02:34:28,640
know, philosophy, you know, who
cares about philosophy?

2685
02:34:28,640 --> 02:34:32,080
But it explained a lot of things
in physics and in science and

2686
02:34:32,080 --> 02:34:34,400
cleared up a lot of problems
across the board.

2687
02:34:34,840 --> 02:34:38,000
All sorts of things made sense,
like quantum mechanics and

2688
02:34:38,000 --> 02:34:42,800
relativity and and things
evolving faster than randomness

2689
02:34:42,800 --> 02:34:44,640
would allow.
And I mean, there's these

2690
02:34:45,000 --> 02:34:48,120
zillions of things that happen
in our world that have no

2691
02:34:48,120 --> 02:34:52,680
explanation, even simple things
like particles tunnelling out of

2692
02:34:53,080 --> 02:34:56,560
into spaces they shouldn't be
allowed to be in, you know,

2693
02:34:56,560 --> 02:34:58,960
these kinds of things.
And Oh yeah, we understand.

2694
02:34:58,960 --> 02:35:00,800
It's part of our science.
Sure, they do this.

2695
02:35:01,200 --> 02:35:04,920
Well, we know they do this, but
we have no idea exactly why that

2696
02:35:04,920 --> 02:35:08,240
works.
And there's a lot of things that

2697
02:35:09,600 --> 02:35:12,040
we're not sure of.
We don't know how why quantum

2698
02:35:12,040 --> 02:35:14,680
mechanics works.
So quantum mechanics will

2699
02:35:14,680 --> 02:35:18,000
explain the tunnelling, but you
can't explain quantum mechanics.

2700
02:35:18,960 --> 02:35:21,520
So you still really don't know
how the funneling works.

2701
02:35:21,520 --> 02:35:23,200
You just have this explanation
of it.

2702
02:35:23,200 --> 02:35:26,120
But that's, you know, so it's
that sort of thing.

2703
02:35:26,120 --> 02:35:29,400
Tell me, were you so many?
Stories a An idealist?

2704
02:35:29,400 --> 02:35:32,840
Or were you at some point a
materialist who just converted

2705
02:35:33,320 --> 02:35:37,440
the thought wise it was well,
you know, I started life and I

2706
02:35:37,440 --> 02:35:45,840
was kind of right brained,
intuitive and I was not real

2707
02:35:46,640 --> 02:35:49,120
intellectual.
I was more holistic.

2708
02:35:50,080 --> 02:35:56,080
I knew that what I needed to do
while I was here was going to

2709
02:35:56,080 --> 02:36:01,440
require me to get my left brain,
you know, honed up.

2710
02:36:01,840 --> 02:36:06,600
So I I knew I wanted to do
things like in science and, you

2711
02:36:06,600 --> 02:36:08,080
know, technical things like
that.

2712
02:36:08,080 --> 02:36:10,280
I was poor.
I was one of the kids that had a

2713
02:36:10,280 --> 02:36:11,840
pension of taking everything
apart.

2714
02:36:12,440 --> 02:36:15,720
You know, whatever I was around,
you know, flashlights, any

2715
02:36:15,720 --> 02:36:18,680
little things around, I'd take
them all apart and see what all

2716
02:36:18,680 --> 02:36:22,280
the pieces did and put them back
together and take them apart

2717
02:36:22,280 --> 02:36:25,520
again.
So I like causality, how things

2718
02:36:25,520 --> 02:36:27,440
worked.
I was drawn to that.

2719
02:36:28,320 --> 02:36:32,640
But when I finally got there in
school, in college, I found math

2720
02:36:32,640 --> 02:36:34,880
really, really hard.
Because that's not the way I

2721
02:36:34,880 --> 02:36:37,280
thought.
I thought in big picture terms,

2722
02:36:37,280 --> 02:36:40,720
not in little logical, you know,
logical process terms.

2723
02:36:41,240 --> 02:36:44,000
But I just kept working that
until I got good at it.

2724
02:36:44,560 --> 02:36:48,320
Eventually I got it and
everything sunk in.

2725
02:36:48,320 --> 02:36:50,680
And then it got to be easy, you
know?

2726
02:36:50,680 --> 02:36:52,440
But it was not easy to begin
with.

2727
02:36:52,920 --> 02:36:56,600
So in the beginning I was more
right brained, more holistic,

2728
02:36:57,600 --> 02:37:00,400
big picture.
Then I turned into more left

2729
02:37:00,400 --> 02:37:04,520
brain, more materialistic.
And when I was in Graduate

2730
02:37:04,520 --> 02:37:09,240
School, I would have agreed with
the idea that reality is best

2731
02:37:09,240 --> 02:37:18,480
defined by what do they call it?
It's the it'll come up to me in

2732
02:37:18,480 --> 02:37:20,320
a minute.
But anyway, if you can't measure

2733
02:37:20,320 --> 02:37:24,520
it, it really doesn't matter.
But anything that's that's real

2734
02:37:24,520 --> 02:37:26,520
is measurable.
In other words, you have to be

2735
02:37:26,520 --> 02:37:28,880
able to interact with it.
That's what I mean by measure.

2736
02:37:29,280 --> 02:37:31,800
You have to be able to
physically interact with it in

2737
02:37:31,800 --> 02:37:34,320
some way.
If you've got something and

2738
02:37:34,320 --> 02:37:37,760
there's no way to physically
interact with it, then that

2739
02:37:37,760 --> 02:37:41,720
doesn't belong in science.
That belongs somewhere else.

2740
02:37:42,200 --> 02:37:45,120
And all of that stuff we throw
into somewhere else really is a

2741
02:37:45,120 --> 02:37:48,240
bunch of nonsense anyway.
You know, that kind of a

2742
02:37:48,320 --> 02:37:52,320
attitude.
So yes, that was a standard

2743
02:37:52,320 --> 02:37:56,320
materialist viewpoint.
And then in Graduate School, I

2744
02:37:56,320 --> 02:38:00,600
had this thing where I could,
you know, I could debug debug

2745
02:38:00,920 --> 02:38:04,960
code paranormally.
And that kind of changed my

2746
02:38:04,960 --> 02:38:06,360
mind.
And I said, oh, well, this is

2747
02:38:06,360 --> 02:38:09,720
some really firm evidence that
there is something else going on

2748
02:38:09,720 --> 02:38:12,360
here besides the physical stuff.
And then I what do?

2749
02:38:12,800 --> 02:38:15,000
You mean like you could debug
code paranormally?

2750
02:38:15,600 --> 02:38:17,600
Oh, I don't know.
You hadn't heard that story.

2751
02:38:19,200 --> 02:38:22,680
I found out in Graduate School
that I first I learned to

2752
02:38:22,680 --> 02:38:24,200
meditate.
I learned to meditate so I

2753
02:38:24,200 --> 02:38:26,240
wouldn't have to get so much
sleep because that's what they

2754
02:38:26,240 --> 02:38:28,800
advertised on their brochure.
How do you say that?

2755
02:38:29,440 --> 02:38:32,760
I'm not sure if I've heard this
this part well.

2756
02:38:32,760 --> 02:38:35,320
I was in Graduate School, I saw
the sign, It was on the physics

2757
02:38:35,320 --> 02:38:38,440
building door and I opened it up
and it said learn to meditate,

2758
02:38:39,040 --> 02:38:41,040
$25.
For students, it was

2759
02:38:41,080 --> 02:38:43,760
Transcendental Meditation
$25.00.

2760
02:38:45,040 --> 02:38:49,280
So they said here's the things,
you know, be more relaxed, you

2761
02:38:49,280 --> 02:38:52,440
know, get more energy, not have
to sleep as much.

2762
02:38:52,760 --> 02:38:54,520
Da da, da da.
And I got that, not have to

2763
02:38:54,520 --> 02:38:57,520
sleep as much because I was a
graduate student doing, doing,

2764
02:38:58,080 --> 02:39:02,520
you know, working with, doing
what we call experimental

2765
02:39:02,520 --> 02:39:05,640
physics with a big Van de Graaff
generator that shooting

2766
02:39:05,640 --> 02:39:08,080
particles that smashed and
keeping track of the pieces.

2767
02:39:08,080 --> 02:39:11,320
And I was doing that.
And when that machine was

2768
02:39:11,320 --> 02:39:15,080
working, you stayed there and
took data because it didn't work

2769
02:39:15,560 --> 02:39:18,000
that long before it broke down.
You know, it was a very

2770
02:39:18,000 --> 02:39:20,480
complicated machine and it was
old.

2771
02:39:20,960 --> 02:39:24,720
And so when the thing was the
thing was working and the data

2772
02:39:24,720 --> 02:39:27,800
was flowing, you know, you might
not get sleep for two or three

2773
02:39:27,800 --> 02:39:30,800
days.
You just have to drink coffee

2774
02:39:30,800 --> 02:39:35,320
and and and take pop caffeine
pills and whatever you had to

2775
02:39:35,320 --> 02:39:37,000
do.
Get your friends to come in and

2776
02:39:37,000 --> 02:39:39,720
and help you take the data, that
kind of thing.

2777
02:39:39,720 --> 02:39:42,600
Because and it's not like, well,
I'll go home and come back in

2778
02:39:42,600 --> 02:39:44,080
the morning and start it up
again.

2779
02:39:45,440 --> 02:39:49,000
That's about a 10% chance that
would work.

2780
02:39:49,440 --> 02:39:51,560
When you start it up again,
there'll be a problem or

2781
02:39:51,560 --> 02:39:56,000
something or with something.
So anyway, so I I like that idea

2782
02:39:56,000 --> 02:40:00,200
of not sleeping so much.
So I paid my $25 and took a

2783
02:40:00,200 --> 02:40:04,760
banana, which was required to
some guy who gave me a mantra.

2784
02:40:05,720 --> 02:40:09,280
And it just was simple, you
know, the very first time I sat

2785
02:40:09,280 --> 02:40:14,320
down, after he gave me the the
mantra, I disappeared for about

2786
02:40:14,320 --> 02:40:16,120
45 minutes and didn't know
where.

2787
02:40:16,120 --> 02:40:19,720
You know, I I thought like maybe
10-15 minutes have gone by and

2788
02:40:19,720 --> 02:40:23,040
almost an hour had gone by.
So I said, wow, that's

2789
02:40:23,040 --> 02:40:27,520
interesting.
And the more I did it, the

2790
02:40:28,960 --> 02:40:32,720
better I got at it.
And one day I was just in a, you

2791
02:40:32,720 --> 02:40:35,000
know, they say meditate twice a
day for half an hour.

2792
02:40:35,000 --> 02:40:38,000
That was the that was the rules.
So I was doing my half an hour

2793
02:40:38,000 --> 02:40:41,840
thing and I was thinking about
my mind wasn't very focused.

2794
02:40:41,840 --> 02:40:46,880
I was thinking about my, my
work, you know, the I had to

2795
02:40:46,880 --> 02:40:50,040
write my own code because all
the science is done these days

2796
02:40:50,040 --> 02:40:52,880
on a computer, you know, So I
and I was back in the days of

2797
02:40:52,880 --> 02:40:54,920
punch cards.
That's how you put stuff into

2798
02:40:54,920 --> 02:40:56,440
the computers, is on punch
cards.

2799
02:40:57,640 --> 02:40:59,960
You'd get a thing back.
You'd throw in your punch cards

2800
02:41:00,240 --> 02:41:03,600
and it either bomb or it would
it would run.

2801
02:41:04,080 --> 02:41:06,120
And when it bombed, there were
no error messages.

2802
02:41:06,120 --> 02:41:09,080
There's no thing that told you,
oh, it was this line was the

2803
02:41:09,080 --> 02:41:10,360
problem.
You know you didn't get any of

2804
02:41:10,360 --> 02:41:12,760
that in those days.
What you got was a message that

2805
02:41:12,760 --> 02:41:16,160
you job bombed.
That's all the information you

2806
02:41:16,160 --> 02:41:18,240
got.
So then you have these card

2807
02:41:18,240 --> 02:41:21,720
decks of like 2000 cards and I
had like two boxes.

2808
02:41:21,720 --> 02:41:26,880
I had 4000 cards and they're all
indexed and of course it matters

2809
02:41:26,880 --> 02:41:29,080
what order they're in.
You can't mess any of the orders

2810
02:41:29,080 --> 02:41:30,680
up with these cards because
they're statements.

2811
02:41:30,680 --> 02:41:35,120
Each card's a statement in a
program and I was just thinking

2812
02:41:35,120 --> 02:41:38,960
about being bomb and I was
having trouble figuring out what

2813
02:41:38,960 --> 02:41:40,680
the problem was, where were the
errors?

2814
02:41:41,200 --> 02:41:45,600
And as I said that a picture of
my print out was up here.

2815
02:41:45,600 --> 02:41:48,000
So I go on a scroll and it's
just rolling down in front of me

2816
02:41:48,360 --> 02:41:50,800
and I could see the print out
because I wrote every line of

2817
02:41:50,800 --> 02:41:52,400
code.
So I knew, you know, I could

2818
02:41:52,400 --> 02:41:54,120
look at it and tell exactly what
it was.

2819
02:41:54,720 --> 02:41:57,800
And then here would be a line
that was in red and I'd note it.

2820
02:41:57,840 --> 02:42:00,240
I'd say, OK, that's an error,
right?

2821
02:42:00,600 --> 02:42:02,200
I got the idea.
Yeah, that's an error.

2822
02:42:02,560 --> 02:42:05,160
So I looked at that code and I
could remember it.

2823
02:42:05,160 --> 02:42:08,080
You know, I like I say, I wrote
every line of it so I knew what

2824
02:42:08,080 --> 02:42:10,720
every line was.
And I found I found another one.

2825
02:42:10,720 --> 02:42:16,120
And I found about four of them.
And one of them was not an error

2826
02:42:17,120 --> 02:42:20,400
in the coding I had done.
It was an error in the key

2827
02:42:20,400 --> 02:42:23,160
punch.
The hole in the card was just a

2828
02:42:23,160 --> 02:42:26,600
little bit off so that couldn't
have been something that was in

2829
02:42:26,600 --> 02:42:29,440
my mind.
The other ones, maybe my

2830
02:42:29,440 --> 02:42:33,280
subconscious said that it it
remembered that I didn't put

2831
02:42:33,280 --> 02:42:37,760
that comma after the you know,
the you know this term or

2832
02:42:37,760 --> 02:42:40,400
something that it needed in a
bomb because it got to that

2833
02:42:40,920 --> 02:42:45,280
point and there was no comma
there no semi colon but that was

2834
02:42:45,280 --> 02:42:49,040
a keep on share.
Nothing I did and I took it in

2835
02:42:49,040 --> 02:42:50,960
and because I couldn't find
anything wrong with it, so I

2836
02:42:50,960 --> 02:42:52,960
took it in and re punched it and
it worked fine.

2837
02:42:53,880 --> 02:42:56,800
I held the two cars up and you
know, one of them was about 1/2

2838
02:42:56,800 --> 02:43:01,000
a millimeter off.
So you know, those are big, just

2839
02:43:01,000 --> 02:43:04,280
mechanical devices.
They they move around and change

2840
02:43:04,280 --> 02:43:09,160
some, you know, with use.
So I realized that this was

2841
02:43:09,160 --> 02:43:14,920
information from elsewhere,
nothing I could possibly have

2842
02:43:14,920 --> 02:43:17,960
known.
And that to me, I'm a physicist.

2843
02:43:17,960 --> 02:43:22,160
I model reality and my thoughts
was, wow, there's another whole

2844
02:43:22,160 --> 02:43:25,280
bunch of reality that I didn't
even know existed.

2845
02:43:25,600 --> 02:43:29,160
But it's there.
So that's where I.

2846
02:43:29,840 --> 02:43:32,160
So there was the.
Really converted you to the

2847
02:43:32,680 --> 02:43:35,720
idealistic.
So then when I I saw that, I

2848
02:43:35,720 --> 02:43:39,280
said well, OK, if you can
measure it, that's puts it in

2849
02:43:39,280 --> 02:43:42,520
this section of our reality.
But there's another part of our

2850
02:43:42,520 --> 02:43:45,920
reality that can't be measured
because this was just mental,

2851
02:43:46,520 --> 02:43:48,920
you know, all of this was just
going on in my mind and yet I

2852
02:43:48,920 --> 02:43:51,760
had information I couldn't
possibly have known that there

2853
02:43:51,760 --> 02:43:54,640
was a key punch error there.
That's just impossible.

2854
02:43:55,400 --> 02:43:57,560
And that would have been a tough
one to find too.

2855
02:43:58,440 --> 02:44:03,760
So anyway, yes, I at that time
then I was very positive about

2856
02:44:03,760 --> 02:44:04,520
it.
And I said, well, there's

2857
02:44:04,520 --> 02:44:11,320
another part of reality that is
not physical and that is very

2858
02:44:11,320 --> 02:44:14,000
meaningful because I get this
right information.

2859
02:44:14,000 --> 02:44:17,080
You know, it's got rules.
See, that's the way physics just

2860
02:44:17,080 --> 02:44:19,480
think about things.
It's got rules, it's got

2861
02:44:19,480 --> 02:44:22,720
structure.
It's not just random, you know,

2862
02:44:22,720 --> 02:44:25,520
It's not just a random field of
information floating around.

2863
02:44:25,520 --> 02:44:28,760
It obviously has structure.
And for some reason I got the

2864
02:44:28,760 --> 02:44:30,920
information that I was thinking
about.

2865
02:44:30,920 --> 02:44:34,560
I was intending my intent was,
what's wrong, What's wrong in

2866
02:44:34,560 --> 02:44:36,360
this thing?
Well, that's a query to the

2867
02:44:36,360 --> 02:44:38,360
database.
I know that now.

2868
02:44:38,360 --> 02:44:41,680
I didn't know that then.
So the fact that I saw my data

2869
02:44:41,920 --> 02:44:44,280
and it started scrolling down
and I saw the red things, well,

2870
02:44:44,280 --> 02:44:45,880
that was an answer to my
question.

2871
02:44:46,440 --> 02:44:51,320
So, you know, I I knew that
there was something else going

2872
02:44:51,320 --> 02:44:54,880
on in the mind that didn't have
anything to do with physical

2873
02:44:54,880 --> 02:44:57,080
reality.
But I didn't know what.

2874
02:44:57,080 --> 02:44:58,520
I didn't know how.
I didn't know why.

2875
02:44:58,520 --> 02:45:00,960
I didn't know anything other
than that it was true.

2876
02:45:01,440 --> 02:45:06,880
And then I run, I go to, I go
get a job and my boss sends me

2877
02:45:06,880 --> 02:45:08,080
Bob and Rose Book.
Yes.

2878
02:45:08,600 --> 02:45:10,960
Yeah, I've heard this story.
Yeah.

2879
02:45:11,320 --> 02:45:15,000
So I eventually go out and I
meet Bob, And Bob just build a

2880
02:45:15,000 --> 02:45:18,560
building to, you know, to try to
study out of body.

2881
02:45:19,000 --> 02:45:22,280
And I said I'm in, I'm in, you
know, I want to learn because I

2882
02:45:22,280 --> 02:45:26,760
know there's something going on
out there and I'm very

2883
02:45:26,760 --> 02:45:29,360
interested.
But I also was very skeptical,

2884
02:45:29,920 --> 02:45:32,800
and I thought, well, if this
turns out just to be a, you

2885
02:45:32,800 --> 02:45:37,200
know, not very productive, and
I'm, I'm out of here.

2886
02:45:37,440 --> 02:45:41,440
But if it's something that
actually helps me understand the

2887
02:45:41,440 --> 02:45:44,960
things I know to be true, which
is that there is more to reality

2888
02:45:44,960 --> 02:45:48,840
than the physical, then wow, a
great opportunity to learn.

2889
02:45:48,840 --> 02:45:50,800
And I'm going to get as much out
of it as I could.

2890
02:45:51,280 --> 02:45:54,360
So that was.
Journey, specifically with the

2891
02:45:54,360 --> 02:45:57,560
TMI and Bob working with Bob,
are you most proud Proud of in

2892
02:45:57,560 --> 02:46:03,360
terms of your guy's work?
Well, the thing that had

2893
02:46:03,360 --> 02:46:06,160
probably the biggest effect was
Dennis and I coming up with the

2894
02:46:06,160 --> 02:46:09,680
with the binaural beat because
that changed everything.

2895
02:46:10,240 --> 02:46:12,560
Suddenly it went from just a
couple of people trying to

2896
02:46:12,560 --> 02:46:14,960
figure things out by themselves
to a whole bunch of people

2897
02:46:14,960 --> 02:46:18,360
getting involved, which is
actually better, you know in the

2898
02:46:18,720 --> 02:46:22,040
in the long run.
But it turned into turned into a

2899
02:46:22,040 --> 02:46:24,560
business and that wasn't so good
because then we weren't doing

2900
02:46:24,560 --> 02:46:28,200
research anymore.
We were, we were you know event,

2901
02:46:28,680 --> 02:46:30,600
you know we we're going out
doing events everywhere.

2902
02:46:30,600 --> 02:46:32,280
And that's not really what I
wanted to be doing.

2903
02:46:32,280 --> 02:46:35,160
I wanted to be figuring out how
does this thing work.

2904
02:46:35,800 --> 02:46:38,560
But I did and I did a lot of
experiments while I was there.

2905
02:46:38,560 --> 02:46:42,320
You know, I one of the things I
learned that was that was that

2906
02:46:42,320 --> 02:46:45,360
I'm, I'm really glad I did, I
guess proud of, I would say.

2907
02:46:45,680 --> 02:46:49,480
And that is that you don't have
to go through the fog to get

2908
02:46:49,480 --> 02:46:51,960
there.
I had this idea that you get

2909
02:46:51,960 --> 02:46:56,560
into an you enter, you, you
meditate and you let the

2910
02:46:56,560 --> 02:47:00,520
physical go and you kind of it
disappears out in the fog and

2911
02:47:00,520 --> 02:47:02,840
it's not there.
And you get foggier and foggier

2912
02:47:03,080 --> 02:47:08,120
because I heard people say that
it's just like falling asleep

2913
02:47:08,760 --> 02:47:12,440
but not losing consciousness.
So I thought I had to get down

2914
02:47:12,440 --> 02:47:16,160
into this right on the edge of,
you know, losing consciousness.

2915
02:47:16,160 --> 02:47:19,760
And somewhere there was the
transition, right on the edge of

2916
02:47:19,760 --> 02:47:22,200
consciousness.
So I'd get down to this place

2917
02:47:22,200 --> 02:47:24,760
that was, I say, foggy.
It's not that there's really fog

2918
02:47:24,760 --> 02:47:28,760
there, but your mental, your
mental capacity was just just

2919
02:47:28,880 --> 02:47:32,400
minimal, just a thread of
awareness still left.

2920
02:47:32,600 --> 02:47:36,320
And that was the place.
Then I could go from there and

2921
02:47:36,440 --> 02:47:38,440
take that back out to being out
of body.

2922
02:47:38,920 --> 02:47:41,680
So I had to always go to out of
body through the fog.

2923
02:47:42,520 --> 02:47:45,000
And I'd get in this fog area and
after a couple of minutes the

2924
02:47:45,000 --> 02:47:47,000
fog would clear and I'd be
someplace else.

2925
02:47:47,720 --> 02:47:51,120
So I never lost consciousness,
but I had to start going through

2926
02:47:51,120 --> 02:47:55,680
the fog and sometimes the the
out of body thing was a little

2927
02:47:55,680 --> 02:47:57,600
unclear and a little foggy
itself.

2928
02:47:58,360 --> 02:48:01,920
Then one day I discovered, and
this was a just a hunch I had,

2929
02:48:01,920 --> 02:48:06,680
that the fog was unnecessary,
but that was just a belief I had

2930
02:48:06,760 --> 02:48:11,160
that it had to go down into the
fog to get rid of the physical.

2931
02:48:11,800 --> 02:48:14,160
So I said, well, I'll just start
just being wide awake.

2932
02:48:14,640 --> 02:48:15,720
Let's start.
I'm not going to meditate.

2933
02:48:15,720 --> 02:48:17,440
I'm not going to do anything,
just going to lie here.

2934
02:48:17,440 --> 02:48:20,000
And then I'm going to start
doing all the same things I did

2935
02:48:20,520 --> 02:48:24,640
when I was went through the fog,
except I'm not going to go there

2936
02:48:24,640 --> 02:48:27,320
first.
Here I am wide awake and now I'm

2937
02:48:27,320 --> 02:48:30,520
going to go heal and I'm going
to remote view and I'm going to

2938
02:48:30,520 --> 02:48:33,160
do all these evidential things.
And I found out it worked just

2939
02:48:33,160 --> 02:48:36,720
as well.
Well, just as well, if not

2940
02:48:36,720 --> 02:48:40,200
better, because I didn't need
all that time wasted and, you

2941
02:48:40,200 --> 02:48:42,880
know, relaxing this relaxing
that, you know, going through

2942
02:48:42,880 --> 02:48:47,080
the fog deeper and deeper and
deeper, you know, And all of

2943
02:48:47,080 --> 02:48:51,920
that was just was ritual.
It was ritual to get your mind

2944
02:48:51,920 --> 02:48:54,560
set in a place that, you know,
you could do what you needed to

2945
02:48:54,560 --> 02:48:57,600
do.
So then I let go of the ritual

2946
02:48:57,600 --> 02:49:00,200
and then I knew I could.
I could go out of body in 1/2 a

2947
02:49:00,200 --> 02:49:03,000
second.
All you have to do is just shift

2948
02:49:03,000 --> 02:49:06,160
your intent.
If your, you know, your data

2949
02:49:06,160 --> 02:49:08,320
stream.
It was just that simple and

2950
02:49:08,320 --> 02:49:13,200
suddenly it just got easier.
And I could do things while I

2951
02:49:13,200 --> 02:49:15,840
did other things.
I could go out of body and talk

2952
02:49:15,840 --> 02:49:17,440
to somebody at the same time,
you know.

2953
02:49:17,440 --> 02:49:21,760
And so I started developing a
lot more robustness.

2954
02:49:22,440 --> 02:49:25,480
Instead of having this very
delicate state that you had to

2955
02:49:25,480 --> 02:49:29,200
get into and hold, you know, so
that you could do this, I could,

2956
02:49:29,640 --> 02:49:31,600
I could do it almost anywhere,
anytime.

2957
02:49:32,040 --> 02:49:35,960
So that was a big breakthrough
for me is that it didn't require

2958
02:49:36,160 --> 02:49:39,280
the fog.
All you had to do was take at

2959
02:49:39,280 --> 02:49:41,960
least a part of your mind.
I could parallel process it, but

2960
02:49:41,960 --> 02:49:44,880
I could take a part of my mind
attached to a different data

2961
02:49:44,880 --> 02:49:50,240
stream.
And fog was not essential to the

2962
02:49:50,240 --> 02:49:52,520
process.
Neither was relaxation, really.

2963
02:49:52,880 --> 02:49:57,320
It was just you had to be able
to have a mental discipline that

2964
02:49:57,320 --> 02:50:01,560
separated parts of your mind
that, you know, kept your own

2965
02:50:01,560 --> 02:50:06,320
business out of what you know of
what you were doing and so on.

2966
02:50:06,320 --> 02:50:08,040
And I practiced those kinds of
things.

2967
02:50:08,040 --> 02:50:11,720
So that was kind of a big
moment, a big moment for me, a

2968
02:50:11,720 --> 02:50:13,920
kind of an aha moment that meant
a lot.

2969
02:50:15,880 --> 02:50:18,520
Other than that, doing this work
with MBT.

2970
02:50:18,960 --> 02:50:22,040
When I first started writing the
book, I thought I understood

2971
02:50:22,040 --> 02:50:26,120
consciousness.
But 456 times along that path of

2972
02:50:26,120 --> 02:50:28,440
writing the book, I realized
this doesn't make any sense.

2973
02:50:28,720 --> 02:50:32,760
I don't know how to get from A
to BI can't do that logically,

2974
02:50:32,760 --> 02:50:35,520
You know, it's like, you know,
you've seen the the joke, you

2975
02:50:35,520 --> 02:50:37,440
know, with the guys writing all
this math on the board.

2976
02:50:37,440 --> 02:50:39,600
And then there's a little arrow.
And on the arrow it says, and

2977
02:50:39,600 --> 02:50:42,080
then the miracle occurred, you
know, and then you start

2978
02:50:42,080 --> 02:50:44,880
someplace else, You know, it's
sort of like that joke.

2979
02:50:45,800 --> 02:50:48,680
I said, this won't do, you know,
if I'm going to, if I'm going to

2980
02:50:48,680 --> 02:50:52,960
lead people intellectually and
rationally to a better space

2981
02:50:52,960 --> 02:50:56,400
where they can be more
productive and and less

2982
02:50:56,440 --> 02:50:59,520
negative.
I can't have these places where

2983
02:50:59,520 --> 02:51:02,080
then then a miracle occurred.
It has to be logical all the

2984
02:51:02,080 --> 02:51:03,840
way.
So then I just spent time

2985
02:51:03,840 --> 02:51:06,920
working on that problem and
working on that problem until I

2986
02:51:06,920 --> 02:51:09,480
solved it and I did.
I eventually I solved all the

2987
02:51:09,480 --> 02:51:11,000
problems and then I wrote the
book.

2988
02:51:11,400 --> 02:51:14,320
But then when I thought I knew
what I was doing, I really

2989
02:51:14,320 --> 02:51:16,720
didn't.
There was a lot of, I realized

2990
02:51:16,720 --> 02:51:20,440
there's a lot of fuzzy thinking
that we tend to do, particularly

2991
02:51:20,440 --> 02:51:22,560
if we're talking, if it's a
verbal thing.

2992
02:51:22,800 --> 02:51:27,160
But when you force yourself to
write it down, writing requires

2993
02:51:27,160 --> 02:51:30,440
a lot more specificity.
You have to say exactly what you

2994
02:51:30,440 --> 02:51:34,160
mean, and you can't say things
that are fuzzy, because when you

2995
02:51:34,160 --> 02:51:36,880
write down stuff that's fuzzy,
it's just obviously fuzzy.

2996
02:51:37,960 --> 02:51:39,720
It sticks right out like a sore
thumb.

2997
02:51:39,720 --> 02:51:42,400
Whereas in your mind you're
saying, yeah, well, it's sort of

2998
02:51:42,400 --> 02:51:44,920
like this And then OK, And then
we go, you know, you just kind

2999
02:51:44,920 --> 02:51:48,120
of gloss over stuff.
So writing it down was very

3000
02:51:48,120 --> 02:51:51,680
important for me to force me
into logical clarity.

3001
02:51:52,520 --> 02:51:58,000
And that took my writing a book,
took five years, I spent five

3002
02:51:58,000 --> 02:52:00,320
years.
And a lot of that was figuring

3003
02:52:00,320 --> 02:52:03,480
out the things that I hadn't
really figured out or thought I

3004
02:52:03,480 --> 02:52:06,360
had, but they weren't really
figured out far enough yet.

3005
02:52:07,040 --> 02:52:12,080
And in that process, the
figuring that out, I came up

3006
02:52:12,080 --> 02:52:18,120
with the model of information.
It's all information, you know,

3007
02:52:18,120 --> 02:52:20,880
like slap yourself in the head
and say, well of course it's

3008
02:52:20,880 --> 02:52:24,120
information.
You know, what else are you

3009
02:52:24,120 --> 02:52:27,960
aware of other than information?
Look, you know, I feel I hear

3010
02:52:27,960 --> 02:52:29,760
what is that?
It's all just information.

3011
02:52:30,240 --> 02:52:32,640
Consciousness is nothing more
than information.

3012
02:52:33,120 --> 02:52:36,200
And then that kind of got me to
the next step, to the next step.

3013
02:52:36,200 --> 02:52:39,640
And eventually I had it all
together and wrote, wrote the

3014
02:52:39,640 --> 02:52:42,760
books.
But it was A and it's a long.

3015
02:52:43,200 --> 02:52:45,920
From an informational
perspective, what What do these

3016
02:52:46,240 --> 02:52:48,160
binaural beats do?
What do they exit?

3017
02:52:48,160 --> 02:52:49,880
What?
What exactly is occurring when

3018
02:52:49,880 --> 02:52:54,960
someone's listening to this?
OK, a binaural beat is a beat

3019
02:52:54,960 --> 02:52:59,240
that you hear because the beat
frequency is taking place inside

3020
02:52:59,240 --> 02:53:02,080
your head.
Now beat frequency is, you know,

3021
02:53:02,080 --> 02:53:06,960
if I have a pure tone here and
another pure tone over here and

3022
02:53:06,960 --> 02:53:10,520
in the air speaker, you know,
and I put a pure by pure tone, I

3023
02:53:10,520 --> 02:53:13,440
mean a single frequency.
So I have a single frequency

3024
02:53:13,440 --> 02:53:17,440
here and a single frequency
here, they'll be exactly the

3025
02:53:17,440 --> 02:53:21,160
same and there's a resonance.
I can these are tuning forks,

3026
02:53:21,160 --> 02:53:23,360
let's say the things that are
tuning forks, OK And that gives

3027
02:53:23,360 --> 02:53:26,440
you a certain vibration because
of the dimensions of the fork.

3028
02:53:27,320 --> 02:53:31,760
So I can just hit this fork and
this one will start to vibrate

3029
02:53:31,760 --> 02:53:35,320
too because it's tuned to that
vibration.

3030
02:53:35,320 --> 02:53:37,840
So that's a resonance.
You can pick this one and the

3031
02:53:37,840 --> 02:53:41,600
other one will go because it
picks up that it's it's made to

3032
02:53:41,600 --> 02:53:43,960
resonate at that frequency if
they're both in the same

3033
02:53:43,960 --> 02:53:46,320
frequency.
Now if I have one of these,

3034
02:53:46,320 --> 02:53:52,280
let's say is 100 Hertz and this
one is 104 and I Ting them both,

3035
02:53:53,080 --> 02:53:56,000
they will beat, there'll be a
beat frequency of four Hertz.

3036
02:53:56,240 --> 02:54:02,920
So 4 Hertz is something like,
you know, 123412341234, You have

3037
02:54:02,920 --> 02:54:08,480
to say 1234 in a second.
It's 4 beats per second.

3038
02:54:08,920 --> 02:54:12,520
So every second, if you can say
1234, that's how fast they go.

3039
02:54:12,920 --> 02:54:16,320
So it's kind of, you know,
that's a four Hertz beat.

3040
02:54:17,120 --> 02:54:20,080
That's because the sounds mix
and where they mix, where the

3041
02:54:20,080 --> 02:54:23,480
waves superimpose, you know, on
each other, where the peaks come

3042
02:54:23,480 --> 02:54:25,120
together, you get a louder
sound.

3043
02:54:25,120 --> 02:54:28,360
Where the peaks are opposite,
you don't get any sound, so you

3044
02:54:28,360 --> 02:54:30,840
get a beat.
The louder sound's the beat.

3045
02:54:30,880 --> 02:54:35,360
And then it's a frequency
because it goes to 0 in between.

3046
02:54:35,680 --> 02:54:37,840
So that's what the beat
frequency is.

3047
02:54:38,240 --> 02:54:41,160
So that takes place in air.
It'll take place in any medium

3048
02:54:41,160 --> 02:54:45,280
in which the two waves meet.
OK, you could put these in a

3049
02:54:45,600 --> 02:54:48,200
piece of metal.
You could both put a pure tone

3050
02:54:48,200 --> 02:54:51,160
in this end of a steel bar and a
pure tone in that end and and

3051
02:54:51,160 --> 02:54:54,360
you'd hear the beat frequencies
coming out of the you know of

3052
02:54:54,360 --> 02:54:58,200
the of the bar as those two
waves process down the the

3053
02:54:58,200 --> 02:55:00,400
metal.
So what happens is you put a

3054
02:55:00,400 --> 02:55:04,880
pure tone in this ear and a pure
tone in this ear they get to the

3055
02:55:04,880 --> 02:55:08,280
corpus callosum which is a
membrane between the two

3056
02:55:08,280 --> 02:55:13,440
hemispheres and they meet down
there and they cause a beat.

3057
02:55:14,080 --> 02:55:17,000
The signals actually interact
with each other at the corpus

3058
02:55:17,000 --> 02:55:21,120
callosum.
And what the this guy Oster who

3059
02:55:21,120 --> 02:55:24,560
read an article in Scientific
American said that it's been

3060
02:55:24,560 --> 02:55:29,600
shown that that drives brain
frequency.

3061
02:55:30,240 --> 02:55:35,640
You know an EEG, you put an EEG
on and you look at all the

3062
02:55:35,640 --> 02:55:39,360
different frequencies that are
being emitted and now you do

3063
02:55:39,360 --> 02:55:42,920
this binaural beat at 4 Hertz.
You're saying that that the

3064
02:55:42,920 --> 02:55:45,640
brain waves, oh, they're all
over the place, you know from

3065
02:55:45,640 --> 02:55:48,560
high to low in and all over and
then come down and now they kind

3066
02:55:48,560 --> 02:55:52,280
of centered 4 Hertz.
So that was they called was

3067
02:55:52,280 --> 02:55:55,600
brain wave entrainment and
trained your brain waves to a

3068
02:55:55,600 --> 02:55:59,720
certain thing.
Well that's what it does.

3069
02:55:59,960 --> 02:56:05,200
And Bob had this one thing that
was kind of evidential in his

3070
02:56:05,200 --> 02:56:08,680
out of body is that he would
feel like a pulsation in his

3071
02:56:08,680 --> 02:56:14,400
body and he he timed it as best
he could and said it was about

3072
02:56:14,400 --> 02:56:18,120
four Hertz.
So we thought, well why not We

3073
02:56:18,120 --> 02:56:21,000
were into trying anything.
You know, we we had no clue what

3074
02:56:21,000 --> 02:56:23,040
we were doing or what would
work.

3075
02:56:23,040 --> 02:56:25,840
So we just, we're trying
everything.

3076
02:56:25,840 --> 02:56:29,440
So we did that.
We put on the binaural beat and

3077
02:56:29,440 --> 02:56:33,520
we listened to it and we put it
at 4 Hertz because that's that's

3078
02:56:33,520 --> 02:56:35,560
where Bob was oscillating right
there.

3079
02:56:36,160 --> 02:56:39,200
Now, why did all that go
together?

3080
02:56:39,200 --> 02:56:41,480
We didn't know, but it just
seemed like a good thing to do.

3081
02:56:41,480 --> 02:56:44,000
So it was maybe intuitive or
maybe it was just luck.

3082
02:56:44,640 --> 02:56:48,040
So we put the binaural beat on
it 4 Hertz, and sure enough put

3083
02:56:48,040 --> 02:56:51,320
you into a Theta state.
And then we find out later that

3084
02:56:51,320 --> 02:56:55,200
that Theta state is exactly the
place where people who've been

3085
02:56:55,200 --> 02:56:59,840
meditating for a long time,
their EEG energy settles down to

3086
02:56:59,840 --> 02:57:03,200
that Theta state, you know.
So you go get some monks out of

3087
02:57:03,200 --> 02:57:06,480
a monastery someplace and wire
them up with the EEG and you'll

3088
02:57:06,480 --> 02:57:10,520
find before before you know,
they they start meditating their

3089
02:57:10,520 --> 02:57:13,320
brain waves like everybody else
and then after they meditate all

3090
02:57:13,320 --> 02:57:18,200
down here at 4 Hertz.
So, and if they were new, it

3091
02:57:18,200 --> 02:57:20,760
wasn't nearly as strong as if
they'd been meditating in a long

3092
02:57:20,760 --> 02:57:22,600
time.
You know, the the old monks that

3093
02:57:22,600 --> 02:57:25,480
were really good at it, they
really narrowed down to, you

3094
02:57:25,480 --> 02:57:28,360
know, to just just a couple of
frequencies in that in that

3095
02:57:28,360 --> 02:57:31,480
pulse.
And so we figured, well, that's

3096
02:57:31,480 --> 02:57:33,360
good.
You know, meditation.

3097
02:57:33,520 --> 02:57:36,400
That's kind of how you get these
altered states.

3098
02:57:36,400 --> 02:57:39,400
It's good idea for Hertz.
That's what Bob felt was that

3099
02:57:39,400 --> 02:57:43,480
vibration and we indeed had also
felt the four Hertz vibration

3100
02:57:43,480 --> 02:57:46,840
cause by then we had also been
able to just do that on our own

3101
02:57:46,840 --> 02:57:49,480
through meditation.
And you know the that 4 Hertz

3102
02:57:49,480 --> 02:57:53,280
beat was was a signpost for us
that we were at the right place.

3103
02:57:55,000 --> 02:57:57,840
So we started the playing with
the binaural beats, different

3104
02:57:57,840 --> 02:57:59,480
base frequencies, different
ways.

3105
02:57:59,640 --> 02:58:03,160
You know, we tried sine waves
and, you know, triangle waves

3106
02:58:03,160 --> 02:58:05,920
and all kinds of things to see
if we couldn't optimize it.

3107
02:58:06,400 --> 02:58:09,800
And we finally got a, you know,
a set of binaural beats that

3108
02:58:09,800 --> 02:58:12,240
were optimal.
Bob wasn't even there then.

3109
02:58:12,240 --> 02:58:14,480
He was given a course someplace
in California.

3110
02:58:15,000 --> 02:58:16,280
He was gone for a couple of
weeks.

3111
02:58:16,280 --> 02:58:18,800
When he came back, we had
already had an optimized

3112
02:58:19,720 --> 02:58:23,120
binaural beat for him, and he
really liked it.

3113
02:58:23,760 --> 02:58:26,360
And then we started bringing
people in, just people off the

3114
02:58:26,360 --> 02:58:29,080
street and saying here, just
listen to this and tell us what

3115
02:58:29,080 --> 02:58:32,840
happens, you know?
And a lot of them just, you

3116
02:58:32,840 --> 02:58:36,280
know, went out in the amazing
spaces and some just fell

3117
02:58:36,280 --> 02:58:38,800
asleep.
But it affected everybody

3118
02:58:38,800 --> 02:58:41,600
almost.
And then we had some monks come

3119
02:58:41,600 --> 02:58:44,520
through, can't remember.
I think they may have been

3120
02:58:44,520 --> 02:58:46,360
Tibetan on some sort of tour or
whatever.

3121
02:58:46,360 --> 02:58:50,200
And they heard a Bob and Roe.
So they stopped and and Bob took

3122
02:58:50,200 --> 02:58:52,480
them all up to the lab and say
here, listen to our sound and

3123
02:58:52,480 --> 02:58:54,120
see what you think of this
sound.

3124
02:58:54,920 --> 02:58:58,400
And these monks came out and
they said, that's amazing.

3125
02:58:58,880 --> 02:59:03,880
They said where that sound puts
you very quickly is where it

3126
02:59:03,960 --> 02:59:07,800
took us about 10 years of
meditation to get to where we

3127
02:59:07,800 --> 02:59:11,960
could do that on our own.
So they were real impressed.

3128
02:59:11,960 --> 02:59:15,160
They said, yeah, song shit,
right into the right into the

3129
02:59:15,160 --> 02:59:18,880
zone you want to be in and holds
you there really well.

3130
02:59:19,480 --> 02:59:22,920
So we were at the time.
Where was anyone else doing

3131
02:59:22,920 --> 02:59:25,320
this?
Was were were banal beats being

3132
02:59:25,320 --> 02:59:29,160
used by any?
Not that I could fail.

3133
02:59:29,160 --> 02:59:31,320
No, we didn't see anybody else
doing this.

3134
02:59:31,640 --> 02:59:34,680
We just had this article.
Short article in Scientific

3135
02:59:34,680 --> 02:59:41,240
American and probably the 9th,
late 1960s, early 70s, a dentist

3136
02:59:41,240 --> 02:59:45,240
happened to run across and it
just said binaural beats.

3137
02:59:45,240 --> 02:59:50,280
And here's what they are and
they seem to drive EEG output,

3138
02:59:51,560 --> 02:59:54,600
Dr. brain waves and train brain
waves and that's all.

3139
02:59:54,600 --> 02:59:56,840
Nobody really knew what to do
with it or anything.

3140
02:59:56,840 --> 03:00:01,800
So it was just a curious fact
that somebody had come across

3141
03:00:02,560 --> 03:00:05,960
and figuring had something to do
with the waves being created in

3142
03:00:05,960 --> 03:00:07,800
the corpus callosum was what
was.

3143
03:00:08,440 --> 03:00:10,680
Or the active thing that was
going on?

3144
03:00:11,000 --> 03:00:13,960
So in essence of all the videos
and like content online that

3145
03:00:13,960 --> 03:00:16,960
comes with with these binaural
beats, trying to assist people

3146
03:00:16,960 --> 03:00:19,600
to meditate, sleep, etcetera,
it's technically coming from you

3147
03:00:19,600 --> 03:00:23,640
guys in a sense, pretty much,
pretty much, yeah.

3148
03:00:23,640 --> 03:00:26,640
We yeah, we started it and it
got to be such a big deal that a

3149
03:00:26,640 --> 03:00:31,000
lot of people started doing it.
Because it's it's there's does

3150
03:00:31,080 --> 03:00:33,880
there's content everywhere
regarding that that content.

3151
03:00:35,560 --> 03:00:38,480
Yeah I have I have my own
binaural beats that if you go to

3152
03:00:38,480 --> 03:00:41,440
my website you can find them.
You know I I don't they don't

3153
03:00:41,440 --> 03:00:44,320
cost very much you know 2530
dollars or something you get a

3154
03:00:44,320 --> 03:00:48,360
whole bunch of them and all
kinds of different bass

3155
03:00:48,360 --> 03:00:51,280
frequencies cause different
people relate better to

3156
03:00:51,280 --> 03:00:55,800
different bass frequencies.
So it's just out of my, you

3157
03:00:55,800 --> 03:00:57,880
know, 40 years experience with
them.

3158
03:00:58,000 --> 03:01:02,600
I kind of put these together as
as optimal and they work really

3159
03:01:02,600 --> 03:01:04,280
well.
Everybody that listens to them,

3160
03:01:04,280 --> 03:01:08,840
they almost always just zip into
a meditation state very quickly.

3161
03:01:09,200 --> 03:01:11,560
And it holds the nerve every
once in a while, one out of

3162
03:01:11,560 --> 03:01:14,360
maybe 2 or 300.
People really just don't like

3163
03:01:14,360 --> 03:01:16,480
them.
They have a problem with them.

3164
03:01:16,560 --> 03:01:19,800
I think they're afraid.
I think they have a fear that

3165
03:01:19,800 --> 03:01:21,880
this is some going to do
something to them.

3166
03:01:22,400 --> 03:01:28,480
It doesn't do anything to you.
It gives you an opportunity to

3167
03:01:28,480 --> 03:01:31,280
have experiences like you've
been meditating for a decade,

3168
03:01:32,280 --> 03:01:35,600
but it doesn't, you know,
there's no residual effect or

3169
03:01:35,600 --> 03:01:40,200
anything that happens.
So it's not a it's not a scary

3170
03:01:40,200 --> 03:01:42,120
thing, but some people just
don't like it.

3171
03:01:42,120 --> 03:01:44,560
But they're very, very few.
Not almost.

3172
03:01:44,560 --> 03:01:47,040
Everybody does like them very
much.

3173
03:01:47,040 --> 03:01:48,800
I'll.
Put a link to that down below.

3174
03:01:49,280 --> 03:01:50,040
Tom.
Again.

3175
03:01:50,040 --> 03:01:51,600
Once again.
I mean it's it's it's so

3176
03:01:51,600 --> 03:01:52,840
incredible to hear these
stories.

3177
03:01:52,840 --> 03:01:55,720
I mean, that's a pretty.
That's that's such a big deal

3178
03:01:55,720 --> 03:01:58,600
because you know how much people
use these nowadays and it's such

3179
03:01:58,600 --> 03:02:00,840
a profound tool for a lot of
people.

3180
03:02:01,320 --> 03:02:02,880
So I can imagine.
I will definitely put a link to

3181
03:02:02,880 --> 03:02:05,280
that below.
Once again Tom, thanks so much.

3182
03:02:05,280 --> 03:02:08,360
It's it's it's been such an
incredible journey again because

3183
03:02:08,360 --> 03:02:12,040
it's past midnight.
I don't, I don't, I don't want

3184
03:02:12,040 --> 03:02:16,320
to give you my worst version.
So I'd rather cut and then

3185
03:02:16,760 --> 03:02:19,640
follow up again with the round
three and then touch on specific

3186
03:02:19,640 --> 03:02:22,320
aspects because what I'm what
I'm thinking would be a great

3187
03:02:22,320 --> 03:02:25,640
idea moving forward would be.
I tailor a bunch of questions,

3188
03:02:25,640 --> 03:02:29,000
curate a whole bunch of perhaps
counter arguments, questions and

3189
03:02:29,000 --> 03:02:32,840
concerns regarding the theory of
everything, and then we go

3190
03:02:32,840 --> 03:02:34,960
through a whole round just
discussing all of those.

3191
03:02:35,000 --> 03:02:37,880
What do you think about that?
Oh sure, that's fine.

3192
03:02:38,720 --> 03:02:43,640
That's fine.
Mostly I find that the the this

3193
03:02:43,640 --> 03:02:49,360
concept of of reality that I
have, you know it solves, it

3194
03:02:49,360 --> 03:02:53,280
solves the the physics problem
with you know how does quantum

3195
03:02:53,280 --> 03:02:55,320
mechanics work.
You know it solves that problem

3196
03:02:56,080 --> 03:02:59,040
and it solves a lot of other
problems too.

3197
03:02:59,520 --> 03:03:04,200
But the physicists aren't too
interested because it's not

3198
03:03:04,200 --> 03:03:07,080
material.
You know they want a materialist

3199
03:03:07,080 --> 03:03:11,000
theory that solves their
problem, not some other problem

3200
03:03:11,000 --> 03:03:13,800
which they don't give much
credence in that.

3201
03:03:13,800 --> 03:03:16,840
I think that.
You are a physicist.

3202
03:03:19,120 --> 03:03:21,520
Well, that's.
I don't know.

3203
03:03:21,520 --> 03:03:26,240
But anyway, it's not, it's not
that hard to understand.

3204
03:03:26,240 --> 03:03:28,040
I mean, I just gave it what, a
20 minutes.

3205
03:03:28,040 --> 03:03:30,400
I gave the whole overview of it
just today.

3206
03:03:31,040 --> 03:03:33,720
But so anybody can understand
that.

3207
03:03:34,080 --> 03:03:36,880
But that's not really
understanding it.

3208
03:03:36,880 --> 03:03:39,240
That's like intellectually
getting some of it.

3209
03:03:39,720 --> 03:03:44,400
You have to really one you have
to do it.

3210
03:03:44,480 --> 03:03:47,240
You have to be it.
You have to do these paranormal

3211
03:03:47,240 --> 03:03:50,360
things and realize that, you
know, just like I did when I was

3212
03:03:50,360 --> 03:03:52,560
reading that stuff.
And I found out that, you know,

3213
03:03:52,680 --> 03:03:54,800
these lines were the ones.
And it turned out those were

3214
03:03:54,800 --> 03:03:56,560
exactly the cards that were the
problem.

3215
03:03:57,480 --> 03:04:01,480
And I fixed all that and it ran
and I started using that, you

3216
03:04:01,480 --> 03:04:04,240
know, every time, you know, I'm
making change and changing

3217
03:04:04,240 --> 03:04:06,360
cards.
And you know, that was my way of

3218
03:04:06,360 --> 03:04:09,840
doing things, and I was much
faster at finding errors than

3219
03:04:09,840 --> 03:04:13,640
anybody else, you know, But it
wasn't because I was cleverer

3220
03:04:13,640 --> 03:04:16,680
than anybody else.
I just had this trick that that

3221
03:04:16,680 --> 03:04:19,280
was using my intuitive side to
come up with that.

3222
03:04:19,920 --> 03:04:24,200
But anyhow, it's a it's a simple
enough idea, and once you

3223
03:04:24,200 --> 03:04:28,160
understand it, so simple that
suddenly everything, all the

3224
03:04:28,160 --> 03:04:31,120
questions you have about how
things work and what's going on

3225
03:04:31,120 --> 03:04:35,960
and it's all fall out.
The simple explanations, elegant

3226
03:04:36,280 --> 03:04:41,880
explanations for all of them.
But, and even though in 20

3227
03:04:42,280 --> 03:04:46,040
minutes, 23 minutes I could
explain it, that doesn't help

3228
03:04:46,040 --> 03:04:49,680
anybody understand it.
You can get that explanation and

3229
03:04:49,680 --> 03:04:53,440
you still don't have a clue
what's going on you.

3230
03:04:53,440 --> 03:05:00,080
It takes most people at least
four or five months of actively

3231
03:05:00,080 --> 03:05:05,080
thinking about it, trying to,
trying to justify in their mind

3232
03:05:05,080 --> 03:05:07,480
how it works, you know?
And that's a struggle.

3233
03:05:07,880 --> 03:05:14,640
Because everything in your life,
all of your culture, tells you

3234
03:05:14,640 --> 03:05:17,640
that that's not right.
That's not the way the world

3235
03:05:17,640 --> 03:05:20,680
works.
You've got this bias toward

3236
03:05:20,680 --> 03:05:23,600
materialism, not because
somebody taught a course on

3237
03:05:23,600 --> 03:05:26,680
materialism, but because it's
just your culture that's part of

3238
03:05:26,680 --> 03:05:30,280
our collective consciousness.
You take that in and you can't

3239
03:05:30,280 --> 03:05:33,080
help it, you know?
So you look at it and you say,

3240
03:05:33,080 --> 03:05:35,720
oh, here's a problem, OK, here's
a problem.

3241
03:05:35,720 --> 03:05:38,720
And it doesn't do the, the.
But the problem is that what

3242
03:05:38,720 --> 03:05:40,880
you're doing is you're coming
with an assumption based on

3243
03:05:40,880 --> 03:05:43,760
materialism, and you're saying
that that doesn't work.

3244
03:05:44,120 --> 03:05:45,680
And you're right, that doesn't
work.

3245
03:05:45,680 --> 03:05:47,520
But that's not what the model's
about.

3246
03:05:47,520 --> 03:05:51,200
You just interpret it that way
because that's where your

3247
03:05:51,440 --> 03:05:54,800
patterns all go through.
They go to materialism for for

3248
03:05:54,800 --> 03:05:58,920
things like how do things work.
That's what makes it hard.

3249
03:05:59,440 --> 03:06:02,920
It's not that the concepts are
the concepts, simple and easy,

3250
03:06:03,440 --> 03:06:08,840
but to to get it to where you
own it and you really understand

3251
03:06:08,840 --> 03:06:12,440
it.
One you need to apply it.

3252
03:06:14,000 --> 03:06:16,600
You need to apply it.
Show yourself that this

3253
03:06:16,600 --> 03:06:18,120
paranormal stuff actually is
real.

3254
03:06:18,840 --> 03:06:20,800
Don't believe me.
That won't get you anywhere.

3255
03:06:20,800 --> 03:06:25,080
Believing me is is irrelevant.
You have to go do it.

3256
03:06:25,600 --> 03:06:28,440
And that's why I've made tools
at my, you know, on my website

3257
03:06:28,440 --> 03:06:30,080
you can find tools for doing
that.

3258
03:06:30,520 --> 03:06:35,200
But so one you have to get into
it to enough that you can do it.

3259
03:06:35,840 --> 03:06:38,400
That's not that hard.
You can do paranormal things

3260
03:06:39,720 --> 03:06:41,400
not.
They're not that hard to do.

3261
03:06:42,240 --> 03:06:45,200
They're not like you have to
work for, you know, 20 years to

3262
03:06:45,560 --> 03:06:49,240
do that.
You just have to get rid of your

3263
03:06:49,240 --> 03:06:52,240
beliefs.
All of your beliefs start fresh

3264
03:06:52,840 --> 03:06:54,440
and just try a bit and you'll
see.

3265
03:06:54,440 --> 03:06:56,880
They'll fall out.
What you're doing is developing

3266
03:06:56,880 --> 03:07:00,440
your intuitive side a little
bit, and the hard thing will be

3267
03:07:00,440 --> 03:07:03,320
getting your intellectual side
to sit down and leave you alone

3268
03:07:03,880 --> 03:07:07,560
because it'll always want to
jump in to the process because

3269
03:07:07,560 --> 03:07:10,040
it's dominant.
Your intellectual side is like

3270
03:07:10,040 --> 03:07:12,560
this powerful, and your
intuitive side is like, you know

3271
03:07:12,640 --> 03:07:16,200
that powerful and that intellect
always wants to jump in and fix

3272
03:07:16,200 --> 03:07:18,800
it.
So that would be the problem.

3273
03:07:18,800 --> 03:07:22,960
So I find that people, it takes
them years before they really

3274
03:07:23,240 --> 03:07:25,520
get it.
I can understand it.

3275
03:07:25,680 --> 03:07:29,400
I love this idea of podcasts
nowadays because just having

3276
03:07:29,400 --> 03:07:31,840
these long form discussions,
particularly this type of long

3277
03:07:31,840 --> 03:07:35,360
form discussion for me
personally has been very helpful

3278
03:07:35,840 --> 03:07:39,720
to to allowing myself to expose
myself to certain theories,

3279
03:07:40,040 --> 03:07:42,800
understandings of reality.
Because as I said the last time,

3280
03:07:42,800 --> 03:07:45,520
I mean, if this was 20 years
ago, 10 years ago, I would never

3281
03:07:45,520 --> 03:07:48,600
even be able to have this
conversation with someone, yes.

3282
03:07:49,120 --> 03:07:51,840
It was an idealist in general.
It would have just been

3283
03:07:51,840 --> 03:07:53,880
completely over the head, Top of
the head for me.

3284
03:07:53,880 --> 03:07:57,640
It would have been absurd,
bizarre, completely crazy.

3285
03:07:57,640 --> 03:08:01,760
But once you understand those
you it's it's as I said before,

3286
03:08:01,760 --> 03:08:05,080
it's micro steps.
You got to take it slowly, take

3287
03:08:05,080 --> 03:08:07,040
it in doses.
Balance is key.

3288
03:08:08,000 --> 03:08:10,520
It takes time.
So it actually takes a couple of

3289
03:08:10,520 --> 03:08:13,400
years before you comfortable
with it that you just think in

3290
03:08:13,400 --> 03:08:15,840
those terms and everything makes
sense.

3291
03:08:16,400 --> 03:08:18,560
You know, all those things that
didn't make sense before just

3292
03:08:18,560 --> 03:08:22,120
make sense and that takes a long
time.

3293
03:08:22,320 --> 03:08:25,200
So it's not an easy thing to
explain to somebody.

3294
03:08:25,520 --> 03:08:29,760
OK, 23 minutes I can kind of
give a hands of, but that

3295
03:08:29,760 --> 03:08:31,320
doesn't help.
They don't understand it.

3296
03:08:31,320 --> 03:08:35,000
They have no idea because they
have all these beliefs that run

3297
03:08:35,000 --> 03:08:39,480
counter to it, and those beliefs
just get in the way and they'll

3298
03:08:39,480 --> 03:08:43,280
find 100 critical problems with
it.

3299
03:08:43,280 --> 03:08:49,080
But every critical problem are
to be their assumption of some

3300
03:08:49,080 --> 03:08:53,240
kind of material thing, and they
can't help it.

3301
03:08:53,240 --> 03:08:56,360
I mean, they know that that's a
problem.

3302
03:08:56,360 --> 03:08:59,640
They're aware of that's a
problem, but they can't get past

3303
03:08:59,640 --> 03:09:02,880
it because it's just innate to
them to think that way.

3304
03:09:03,240 --> 03:09:07,920
So that's the problem is, it's a
simple thing, but it's a really

3305
03:09:07,920 --> 03:09:11,200
difficult thing that you're
going to have to work for before

3306
03:09:11,200 --> 03:09:15,520
you get it because it is just so
counter to the way you think and

3307
03:09:15,520 --> 03:09:20,000
to what you believe that it you
just have to work through all of

3308
03:09:20,000 --> 03:09:24,200
that belief and discard it.
And that's hard to do.

3309
03:09:24,440 --> 03:09:27,480
You just don't rip your beliefs
up because you think you want

3310
03:09:27,560 --> 03:09:30,040
to.
Yeah, it's it's a difficult

3311
03:09:30,040 --> 03:09:31,840
thing to do in.
This case Tom, I think the

3312
03:09:31,840 --> 03:09:34,760
benefit would be is.
Well, me hosting this show

3313
03:09:34,760 --> 03:09:37,320
though as opposed to a random
question generator.

3314
03:09:37,520 --> 03:09:40,320
The nice thing is I'll be able
to curate those those questions

3315
03:09:40,520 --> 03:09:43,560
and and sort of sift through the
ones who are unable to do that,

3316
03:09:44,000 --> 03:09:46,880
get some of those questions that
do have that sceptical element

3317
03:09:46,880 --> 03:09:48,800
because of the materialism
because it will help the

3318
03:09:48,800 --> 03:09:51,040
conversation flow.
But the nice thing will be is

3319
03:09:51,040 --> 03:09:53,600
that I'll actually tailor it
according to those who are

3320
03:09:53,600 --> 03:09:57,720
curious beyond the material and
and and hopefully have another

3321
03:09:58,000 --> 03:10:00,480
wonderful discussion because
it's it's always a fascinating

3322
03:10:00,480 --> 03:10:02,600
journey for me.
Yeah.

3323
03:10:02,600 --> 03:10:05,720
I think it'll be fun you know
and I think it's good if you if

3324
03:10:05,720 --> 03:10:09,440
you can keep enough of your
people interested long enough

3325
03:10:09,440 --> 03:10:13,400
for them to actually get it then
that will be that will be good.

3326
03:10:13,720 --> 03:10:16,560
But you know if even only two or
three people get it that's good

3327
03:10:16,560 --> 03:10:19,560
too.
You know it's it's it's not it's

3328
03:10:19,560 --> 03:10:21,520
not like you have to make
everybody see it.

3329
03:10:22,040 --> 03:10:23,080
Some people just.
Quantity.

3330
03:10:23,200 --> 03:10:26,720
Sometimes you just got to, you
got to get those, those Ray GMs

3331
03:10:26,760 --> 03:10:31,160
involved, then I've got
something coming out, but you'll

3332
03:10:31,160 --> 03:10:36,680
probably see in another three or
four weeks, got something coming

3333
03:10:36,680 --> 03:10:40,880
out in a couple of weeks, that
is, it's not long, it's only

3334
03:10:40,880 --> 03:10:43,400
about 20 minutes.
So it's something that people

3335
03:10:43,400 --> 03:10:49,520
can actually watch and it gives
a history of kind of physics

3336
03:10:50,080 --> 03:10:54,520
kind of a, you know, a physics
history kind of philosophy of

3337
03:10:54,520 --> 03:10:56,920
science kind of thing.
And it looks at the quantum

3338
03:10:57,000 --> 03:11:02,880
quantum physics and starts in
the 1920s where or 19/15/1925 in

3339
03:11:02,880 --> 03:11:08,040
that that decade where quantum
theory was coming together and

3340
03:11:08,040 --> 03:11:11,160
what physics did with that and
and kind of through the process

3341
03:11:11,160 --> 03:11:15,880
up to today and it's I think
that's pretty interesting.

3342
03:11:15,880 --> 03:11:17,920
Interpretation.
You're going to go through that

3343
03:11:17,920 --> 03:11:19,400
whole journey?
Yeah.

3344
03:11:19,920 --> 03:11:23,680
Because, you know, I don't know
if I've mentioned this, but what

3345
03:11:23,680 --> 03:11:27,560
my what?
What my derivation?

3346
03:11:27,760 --> 03:11:29,760
You know, I said that I dare I
derive physics.

3347
03:11:30,000 --> 03:11:34,840
What I get is the Copenhagen
results, That's what I get.

3348
03:11:34,840 --> 03:11:39,840
So my model says Copenhagen
results were the real results.

3349
03:11:39,840 --> 03:11:43,320
They were absolutely right.
You didn't see this podcast, but

3350
03:11:43,320 --> 03:11:45,280
I have, I have seen you say that
before.

3351
03:11:45,520 --> 03:11:49,440
But the but science, economic
physics has kind of gotten away

3352
03:11:49,440 --> 03:11:53,120
from that because the Copenhagen
results were too woo woo, there

3353
03:11:53,120 --> 03:11:56,400
was too much stuff there then
that consciousness was a problem

3354
03:11:56,400 --> 03:11:58,280
And so they wanted to get away
from that.

3355
03:11:58,280 --> 03:12:01,520
So you can see the steps that
they took and and the process

3356
03:12:01,520 --> 03:12:07,160
they made to to to kind of slip
away from Copenhagen because

3357
03:12:07,160 --> 03:12:12,000
Copenhagen was embarrassing that
all these people, you know,

3358
03:12:12,200 --> 03:12:14,320
asking them questions about,
well, what does conscious have

3359
03:12:14,320 --> 03:12:15,760
to do with it?
And they just didn't know the

3360
03:12:15,760 --> 03:12:18,400
answers and they didn't like the
answers.

3361
03:12:18,440 --> 03:12:22,880
They wanted it to be materialism
that was straightforward, you

3362
03:12:22,880 --> 03:12:27,200
know, materialism.
And they weren't able to do that

3363
03:12:27,200 --> 03:12:29,440
though.
Anyhow, they did throw away at

3364
03:12:29,440 --> 03:12:33,920
Copenhagen.
Copenhagen is not in high regard

3365
03:12:33,920 --> 03:12:36,440
anymore.
That's that's been thrown out.

3366
03:12:36,680 --> 03:12:39,920
So my little talk is about all
the history of that and how that

3367
03:12:39,920 --> 03:12:41,560
worked and where it is and so
on.

3368
03:12:41,560 --> 03:12:44,640
And I I think your people would
probably find that to be

3369
03:12:44,640 --> 03:12:48,360
interesting.
So in about actually I've got it

3370
03:12:48,360 --> 03:12:51,840
done and I already have the
video but I'm going to have some

3371
03:12:51,840 --> 03:12:54,360
kind of an event in a couple of
weeks and I want to kind of do

3372
03:12:54,360 --> 03:12:58,600
the the the first showing there,
you know with the and then after

3373
03:12:58,600 --> 03:12:59,920
that it'll go up on YouTube
it's.

3374
03:13:00,160 --> 03:13:01,640
About 20 minutes.
What is it as Tom?

3375
03:13:01,640 --> 03:13:04,120
Is it like a documentary or is
it a huge giving lecture series?

3376
03:13:04,120 --> 03:13:04,640
What?
What is?

3377
03:13:04,640 --> 03:13:06,240
It's me.
It's me talking.

3378
03:13:06,440 --> 03:13:07,600
OK.
No, nice.

3379
03:13:07,600 --> 03:13:09,520
I have some, I have, I have some
slides.

3380
03:13:09,760 --> 03:13:12,120
So it's not just talking head,
there's some slides to it.

3381
03:13:12,560 --> 03:13:17,760
And it's just me talking,
explaining that century.

3382
03:13:18,320 --> 03:13:20,880
You know what?
What did that century from, you

3383
03:13:20,880 --> 03:13:28,480
know, 1915 to 1920 to 2015 to,
you know, 2020, 2025, We're not

3384
03:13:28,480 --> 03:13:30,760
quite a century entirely away
from that.

3385
03:13:31,160 --> 03:13:33,320
What did that?
How did physics evolve

3386
03:13:33,320 --> 03:13:37,040
throughout that throughout that
century and why?

3387
03:13:37,240 --> 03:13:38,760
Where did it?
Where did it go?

3388
03:13:39,560 --> 03:13:40,600
And I'll definitely put a
little.

3389
03:13:40,960 --> 03:13:42,440
This video as well once once
yeah.

3390
03:13:42,440 --> 03:13:44,920
I think you'll I think you'll
find that to be very interesting

3391
03:13:44,920 --> 03:13:50,360
because they will see the once
you understand that story then

3392
03:13:50,360 --> 03:13:54,520
it will be easier for you to let
go of materialism because you'll

3393
03:13:54,520 --> 03:13:59,680
kind of see where the you know
where where it went wrong and

3394
03:13:59,840 --> 03:14:05,920
and you'll see also some of some
of the successes of the of the I

3395
03:14:05,920 --> 03:14:09,520
give a whole list along
successes with your paradoxes

3396
03:14:09,520 --> 03:14:13,960
that got answered you know by by
this this theory that otherwise

3397
03:14:13,960 --> 03:14:15,960
don't have any answers they're
just mysteries.

3398
03:14:16,520 --> 03:14:22,560
So it's AI think it's it's not
that deep and it's most people

3399
03:14:22,560 --> 03:14:26,680
will get it right away and it's
only 20 minutes long.

3400
03:14:26,680 --> 03:14:31,160
So it's a good intro to this to
this subject.

3401
03:14:31,160 --> 03:14:35,040
Now you're digging a lot deeper
into it with our with our talk,

3402
03:14:35,040 --> 03:14:38,120
but this is a good introduction.
I think it'll be I.

3403
03:14:38,240 --> 03:14:39,880
Think they'll enjoy it.
I think that sounds like a

3404
03:14:39,880 --> 03:14:42,480
wonderful concept as well.
And I'll definitely have a link

3405
03:14:42,480 --> 03:14:43,880
to that.
Thanks again, Tom.

3406
03:14:43,880 --> 03:14:45,920
Thank you so much.
I appreciate your time always.

3407
03:14:46,880 --> 03:14:49,240
You're welcome, Dev.
It's.

3408
03:14:49,880 --> 03:14:53,800
I enjoy talking with you and I
appreciate you your time too,

3409
03:14:53,800 --> 03:14:58,160
because you're going to spread
this out and hopefully we'll get

3410
03:14:58,160 --> 03:15:01,600
some people to, yeah, get a
bigger, get a bigger picture.

3411
03:15:01,600 --> 03:15:02,640
I think the world needs it.